Discussion:
Toshiba W-7 went dark
(too old to reply)
HB
2018-03-10 07:15:13 UTC
Permalink
When it rains it pours. The Toshiba LP W-7 64 went dark. It was fine, was
shut off and when I hit the On button a few days later, just a black screen
with a blinking " - " in the upper left-hand corner. Tapping the F8 is
supposed to bring up Safe Mode (as per Google) but instead up came a screen
to do a memory scan. After it finished I tried again and it came up with 6
tabs of technical info that's alien to me. None of the tabs were for Safe
Mode. I had no way to know what to do on any of the screens. Anyone know how
to get Safe Mode to come up on a Toshiba W-7?

Where do I go from here? The LP actually gets little use and is like new. I
hate to recycle it.

I noticed a few days before that the battery wasn't charging. Since it was
almost always used plugged in, it didn't matter.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-03-10 09:21:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by HB
When it rains it pours. The Toshiba LP W-7 64 went dark. It was fine, was
shut off and when I hit the On button a few days later, just a black screen
with a blinking " - " in the upper left-hand corner. Tapping the F8 is
supposed to bring up Safe Mode (as per Google) but instead up came a screen
to do a memory scan. After it finished I tried again and it came up with 6
tabs of technical info that's alien to me. None of the tabs were for Safe
Mode. I had no way to know what to do on any of the screens. Anyone know how
to get Safe Mode to come up on a Toshiba W-7?
Where do I go from here? The LP actually gets little use and is like new. I
hate to recycle it.
I noticed a few days before that the battery wasn't charging. Since it was
almost always used plugged in, it didn't matter.
Safe Mode is part of Windows; the computer needs to be working even to
run that. (I. e. it's _not_ part of the computer.) Sounds to me as if
some part of the computer itself is not working: I'd have guessed the
hard drive, but the message suggests it might be the memory.

As an outside thing to try, but as it's easy to do: try physically
removing the battery, then seeing if it will boot; the non-charging
suggests the battery may have died; if it has, it _might_ have done so
in such a way that it's loading things excessively. Unlikely, but as I
say easy to try. (If system shows no sign of life at all with the
battery out, then the battery is OK, but the external power supply may
have died - does it have a light on it you can check? [Or have you a
voltmeter?] - or something in between: the power in socket, or its
solder connections, is a common culprit.)
If that proves not to make any difference, then in view of the message
about the memory, I'd _try_ removing and reseating that, in case it's
just not making proper contact: if still no, remove, clean its contacts,
and reseat. If still no good and there are more than one module, try
booting with just one then just the other.
Failing that, perhaps the same with the hard drive - I've had them just
slide out of contact.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Does my Bradshaw look big in this?
HB
2018-03-11 03:11:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by HB
When it rains it pours. The Toshiba LP W-7 64 went dark. It was fine, was
shut off and when I hit the On button a few days later, just a black screen
with a blinking " - " in the upper left-hand corner. Tapping the F8 is
supposed to bring up Safe Mode (as per Google) but instead up came a screen
to do a memory scan. After it finished I tried again and it came up with 6
tabs of technical info that's alien to me. None of the tabs were for Safe
Mode. I had no way to know what to do on any of the screens. Anyone know how
to get Safe Mode to come up on a Toshiba W-7?
Where do I go from here? The LP actually gets little use and is like new. I
hate to recycle it.
I noticed a few days before that the battery wasn't charging. Since it was
almost always used plugged in, it didn't matter.
Safe Mode is part of Windows; the computer needs to be working even to run
that. (I. e. it's _not_ part of the computer.) Sounds to me as if some
part of the computer itself is not working: I'd have guessed the hard
drive, but the message suggests it might be the memory.
It did a memory check and found it was OK.
As an outside thing to try, but as it's easy to do: try physically
removing the battery, then seeing if it will boot; the non-charging
suggests the battery may have died; if it has, it _might_ have done so in
such a way that it's loading things excessively. Unlikely, but as I say
easy to try. (If system shows no sign of life at all with the battery out,
then the battery is OK, but the external power supply may have died - does
it have a light on it you can check? [Or have you a voltmeter?] - or
something in between: the power in socket, or its solder connections, is a
common culprit.)
If that proves not to make any difference, then in view of the message
about the memory, I'd _try_ removing and reseating that, in case it's just
not making proper contact: if still no, remove, clean its contacts, and
reseat. If still no good and there are more than one module, try booting
with just one then just the other.
Will try this tonight. It's worth a try. Thanks.
Failing that, perhaps the same with the hard drive - I've had them just
slide out of contact.
--
Does my Bradshaw look big in this?
VanguardLH
2018-03-10 16:47:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by HB
When it rains it pours. The Toshiba LP W-7 64 went dark. It was fine, was
shut off and when I hit the On button a few days later, just a black screen
with a blinking " - " in the upper left-hand corner. Tapping the F8 is
supposed to bring up Safe Mode (as per Google) but instead up came a screen
to do a memory scan. After it finished I tried again and it came up with 6
tabs of technical info that's alien to me. None of the tabs were for Safe
Mode. I had no way to know what to do on any of the screens. Anyone know how
to get Safe Mode to come up on a Toshiba W-7?
Where do I go from here? The LP actually gets little use and is like new. I
hate to recycle it.
I noticed a few days before that the battery wasn't charging. Since it was
almost always used plugged in, it didn't matter.
Some laptops won't run without a main battery installed. However, if
the main battery is dead, the laptop may not come up even when the
laptop's power adapter is plugged into A/C power. I'm not sure how the
circuitry is designed but I have seen some where the battery was used as
a capacitor in the power logic. If voltage regulation relies on a
working main battery, try removing it. How old is the battery? Sounds
like it is too old and you need to replace it.

F8 brings up the boot menu, not necessarily Windows safe mode. Once in
the startup menu, you decide how to continue booting. Safe mode is just
one of the boot options. F8 should bring up the boot menu which look
like this:

Loading Image...
(from https://neosmart.net/wiki/f8-key/)

However, that boot menu is presented by the kernel loader of Windows.
When you see the Advanced Options boot menu, you're already in Windows.
If Windows is corrupted, you might not get the F8 boot menu.

Toshiba is a brand name, not a model number. You never identified your
laptop. "LP" (laptop) doesn't identify WHAT you have. It's possible
Toshiba fucked up the F8 standard of getting into the Windows boot menu
and replaced F8's action to perform something else. Don't know because
you never identified the model for anyone else to go look in the manual
for that model.
HB
2018-03-11 03:42:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by VanguardLH
Post by HB
When it rains it pours. The Toshiba LP W-7 64 went dark. It was fine, was
shut off and when I hit the On button a few days later, just a black screen
with a blinking " - " in the upper left-hand corner. Tapping the F8 is
supposed to bring up Safe Mode (as per Google) but instead up came a screen
to do a memory scan. After it finished I tried again and it came up with 6
tabs of technical info that's alien to me. None of the tabs were for Safe
Mode. I had no way to know what to do on any of the screens. Anyone know how
to get Safe Mode to come up on a Toshiba W-7?
Where do I go from here? The LP actually gets little use and is like new. I
hate to recycle it.
I noticed a few days before that the battery wasn't charging. Since it was
almost always used plugged in, it didn't matter.
Some laptops won't run without a main battery installed. However, if
the main battery is dead, the laptop may not come up even when the
laptop's power adapter is plugged into A/C power. I'm not sure how the
circuitry is designed but I have seen some where the battery was used as
a capacitor in the power logic. If voltage regulation relies on a
working main battery, try removing it. How old is the battery? Sounds
like it is too old and you need to replace it.
It's the original battery. Was in the LT when relative gave it to me. BTW,
all it says on the Toshiba is Satalite. It's 64-bit.
Post by VanguardLH
F8 brings up the boot menu, not necessarily Windows safe mode. Once in
the startup menu, you decide how to continue booting. Safe mode is just
one of the boot options. F8 should bring up the boot menu which look
https://neosmart.net/wiki/wp-content/uploads/sites/5/2013/09/Windows-XP-Advanced-Boot-Options.png
(from https://neosmart.net/wiki/f8-key/)
That's what I'm familiar with. Never saw that window yesterday. I finally
got a screen asking to insert the original CD. None exists so I guess I'm
out of options.
Post by VanguardLH
However, that boot menu is presented by the kernel loader of Windows.
When you see the Advanced Options boot menu, you're already in Windows.
If Windows is corrupted, you might not get the F8 boot menu.
Toshiba is a brand name, not a model number. You never identified your
laptop. "LP" (laptop) doesn't identify WHAT you have. It's possible
Toshiba fucked up the F8 standard of getting into the Windows boot menu
and replaced F8's action to perform something else. Don't know because
you never identified the model for anyone else to go look in the manual
for that model.
Sorry, didn't think to add that. It's a Satellite.

The better half just said to remove the HD, give it a few good whacks with
the sledge hammer and dump them in the electronic recycle bin at the
dumpsters. I often take her advice. I appreciate everyone's time trying to
help.
VanguardLH
2018-03-11 05:00:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by HB
It's the original battery. Was in the LT when relative gave it to me. BTW,
all it says on the Toshiba is Satalite. It's 64-bit.
Doesn't answer the question "How old is the battery?".
Post by HB
Post by VanguardLH
Toshiba is a brand name, not a model number. You never identified your
laptop. "LP" (laptop) doesn't identify WHAT you have. It's possible
Toshiba fucked up the F8 standard of getting into the Windows boot menu
and replaced F8's action to perform something else. Don't know because
you never identified the model for anyone else to go look in the manual
for that model.
Sorry, didn't think to add that. It's a Satellite.
Satellite is a model family name. There are many models under that
family. Searching on "toshiba satellite battery" shows there are more
than one model for batteries that fit various Satellite models.

https://support.toshiba.com/sscontent?contentId=4007069
In that example, the part number is the model number.

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-0e5d2edfd0dcda35d538c2abb818da2d-c
In that example, the model number is overtly identified.

Loading Image...
In that example, the model number is right after "Satellite".


That's a video on where to look for the model family name and model
number.

You can also go to Toshiba's support page and enter in either the model
number or serial number, whichever is legible, to find out what you
have. I doubt a legitimate label from Toshiba on their laptop would
only say "Toshiba" and "Satellite". You need to look at the underside
label. If the underside label on the laptop has been obliterated to
become illegible that you cannot see or decipher a model or part number,
there should be a model number printed on the main battery that you can
use to search for a replacement battery. Unlike the label on the
underside of the laptop, the label on the battery gets no wear.

Batteries don't last forever even when properly stored. They're made of
chemicals that deteriorate. Is that old laptop not worth the $20 (*)
for a replacement battery?

(*) Per pricing at Walmart but only for some models of battery packs.
Post by HB
The better half just said to remove the HD, give it a few good whacks with
the sledge hammer and dump them in the electronic recycle bin at the
dumpsters. I often take her advice. I appreciate everyone's time trying to
help.
Some locales do not allow dumping electronics into their waste
facilities due to the lead in the solder. The unit may not be
recyclable if you smash it to pieces. Your locale may require you drop
it off at a hazardous waste recycle center, so don't smash it up. Or
drop it off at the Goodwill. Someone else might want it, wipe the
drive, and start with a fresh install of the OS. They might figure
getting a new battery makes for a cheap laptop.
HB
2018-03-11 10:11:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by VanguardLH
Post by HB
It's the original battery. Was in the LT when relative gave it to me.
BTW,
all it says on the Toshiba is Satalite. It's 64-bit.
Doesn't answer the question "How old is the battery?".
Post by HB
Post by VanguardLH
Toshiba is a brand name, not a model number. You never identified your
laptop. "LP" (laptop) doesn't identify WHAT you have. It's possible
Toshiba fucked up the F8 standard of getting into the Windows boot menu
and replaced F8's action to perform something else. Don't know because
you never identified the model for anyone else to go look in the manual
for that model.
Sorry, didn't think to add that. It's a Satellite.
Satellite is a model family name. There are many models under that
family. Searching on "toshiba satellite battery" shows there are more
than one model for batteries that fit various Satellite models.
https://support.toshiba.com/sscontent?contentId=4007069
In that example, the part number is the model number.
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-0e5d2edfd0dcda35d538c2abb818da2d-c
In that example, the model number is overtly identified.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/fileadmin/_processed_/csm_Toshiba_C55_A_1D5_Typenschild_d38b165e44.jpg
In that example, the model number is right after "Satellite".
http://youtu.be/url44LeZvgo
That's a video on where to look for the model family name and model
number.
You can also go to Toshiba's support page and enter in either the model
number or serial number, whichever is legible, to find out what you
have. I doubt a legitimate label from Toshiba on their laptop would
only say "Toshiba" and "Satellite". You need to look at the underside
label. If the underside label on the laptop has been obliterated to
become illegible that you cannot see or decipher a model or part number,
there should be a model number printed on the main battery that you can
use to search for a replacement battery. Unlike the label on the
underside of the laptop, the label on the battery gets no wear.
Batteries don't last forever even when properly stored. They're made of
chemicals that deteriorate. Is that old laptop not worth the $20 (*)
for a replacement battery?
(*) Per pricing at Walmart but only for some models of battery packs.
Post by HB
The better half just said to remove the HD, give it a few good whacks with
the sledge hammer and dump them in the electronic recycle bin at the
dumpsters. I often take her advice. I appreciate everyone's time trying to
help.
Some locales do not allow dumping electronics into their waste
facilities due to the lead in the solder. The unit may not be
recyclable if you smash it to pieces. Your locale may require you drop
it off at a hazardous waste recycle center, so don't smash it up. Or
drop it off at the Goodwill. Someone else might want it, wipe the
drive, and start with a fresh install of the OS. They might figure
getting a new battery makes for a cheap laptop.
On the back it just says Satellite followed by numbers. I don't know which
numbers would be relevant. This is the 1st number. C655D (or 0) S5063 system
unit.

What makes you think it's the battery since it worked fine without it as
long as it was plugged in? I had this same "going blank" with the blinking
"-" in the upper left hand corner before and they were desktops. I don't
remember the exact figures anymore but to fix them, according to the shops
where I lived at the time, wasn't worth what it would cost. An XP and a
Vista both went the same way.

It wasn't dead when plugged in as info came up when I tapped F2 or F8 but
not safe mode. Nothing that showed was familiar to me. A repair tech would
know what the info meant but it was Chinese to me. So it didn't need a
battery to run. I hate to toss it because it's like new. No one liked it
because it was slow. I was hoping to do a system recovery but couldn't get
into safe mode. I don't know any other way to do a system restore or
recovery.
Java Jive
2018-03-11 12:55:11 UTC
Permalink
On 11/03/2018 10:11, HB wrote:
(much snipped for brevity)

I think either I or Vanguard must be mistaken. He seems to be implying
that you were about to crunch the entire laptop with a sledge hammer,
whereas I think your other half meant just the hard drive, assuming it
was dead, did she not? This is a standard way of preventing personal
data being retrieved from binned HDs. Personally, I use a lump hammer
and a cold chisel on a concrete floor or step.

But is the HD really dead, or has it just got corrupted ...
Post by HB
On the back it just says Satellite followed by numbers. I don't know which
numbers would be relevant. This is the 1st number. C655D (or 0) S5063 system
unit.
I would suggest going to Toshiba's site and comparing what you have with
pictures of other models and their given designations one of which will
probably be close to the above. When dealing with problems or buying
spares, it is *nearly always important* to know exactly what it is that
you have.
Post by HB
What makes you think it's the battery since it worked fine without it as
long as it was plugged in? I had this same "going blank" with the blinking
"-" in the upper left hand corner before and they were desktops. I don't
remember the exact figures anymore but to fix them, according to the shops
where I lived at the time, wasn't worth what it would cost. An XP and a
Vista both went the same way.
Shops may be right in that it may not be commercially viable for them to
make certain types of repairs, or for you to pay them to do so, but
probably they also hope that they can persuade you to buy a replacement
from their stock, while some repairs, a new battery is a good example,
you can do yourself economically.
Post by HB
It wasn't dead when plugged in as info came up when I tapped F2 or F8 but
not safe mode. Nothing that showed was familiar to me. A repair tech would
know what the info meant but it was Chinese to me. So it didn't need a
battery to run. I hate to toss it because it's like new. No one liked it
because it was slow. I was hoping to do a system recovery but couldn't get
into safe mode. I don't know any other way to do a system restore or
recovery.
Most PCs can do some primitive diagnostics from the BIOS. The BIOS is
usually entered by pressing or holding down a particular key at a
particular stage in the boot process - favourites are <Del>, and
either <F10> or one of the other function keys across the top of the
keyboard. Again, going on to Toshiba's site and identifying the model
number may help you find out which key is the magic one. Some laptops,
such as Dells, can even perform full diagnostic tests by pressing a
different magic key, IIRC <F11>, but my memory for such intermittently
used information is getting a little dodgy these days, and anyway you
have a Toshiba, not a Dell, so it's likely to be a different key, if
full diagnostics are available at all.

You may find this page on my site, useful - although when written I
mostly had desktops in mind, since writing it I've repaired some laptops
as well, and while the details may be different, the principles are
exactly the same:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/PCHardware/HardwareFaults.html

In particular, either ...

If the laptop can boot from a USB stick, then download an Ubuntu or
other Linux distro - make sure you get a suitable one, 32-bit or
64-bit as appropriate - install it on a 2GB or larger USB stick,
depending on the size of the download, and see what messages Linux
generates as it tries to boot the PC. This may give you some useful
pointers to a hardware fault. If the PC boots from the stick, then you
should see your hard disk partition(s) as clickable icons down the left
hand side menu (in Ubuntu, other distros may be different, for example
the icons may be on the desktop). Try this and come back to us with a
description of what happens, particularly whether the PC boots at all,
whether Linux lets see your HD at all, and even the contents of it.

Or ...

If you can mount the HD in a desktop, do that and diagnose it from
there. If, as is likely with an old laptop, you have an IDE drive, you
would need a 2.5"-to-3.5" HD connector/convertor and attach the other
side of that to a spare IDE connector and power cable, whereas a SATA
drive can be attached directly to a standard SATA cable, but you may
need a convertor for the power cable - it all depends on the
particular combination of laptop HD and desktop motherboard and power
supply cables. Try this and do a chkdsk on the laptop's HD - you will
probably have to go into Disk Manager and give the laptop HD a drive
letter first.

Either way, you should be able to find out if the HD can be retrieved by
repartitioning and reinstalling, and the first should also suggest
whether and how much of the rest of the PC is functioning correctly.
HB
2018-03-12 21:26:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Java Jive
(much snipped for brevity)
I think either I or Vanguard must be mistaken. He seems to be implying
that you were about to crunch the entire laptop with a sledge hammer,
whereas I think your other half meant just the hard drive, assuming it was
dead, did she not? This is a standard way of preventing personal data
being retrieved from binned HDs. Personally, I use a lump hammer and a
cold chisel on a concrete floor or step.
Yes, that's what she meant. Destroy the HD.
Post by Java Jive
But is the HD really dead, or has it just got corrupted ...
It's not dead as it brought up technical screens when tapping F8 or F2. It
ran fine with the battery not charged and plugged in.
Post by Java Jive
Post by HB
On the back it just says Satellite followed by numbers. I don't know which
numbers would be relevant. This is the 1st number. C655D (or 0) S5063 system
unit.
I would suggest going to Toshiba's site and comparing what you have with
pictures of other models and their given designations one of which will
probably be close to the above. When dealing with problems or buying
spares, it is *nearly always important* to know exactly what it is that
you have.
This was given to us by a realtive. She said it was too slow and wanted a
better faster newer laptop.
Post by Java Jive
Post by HB
What makes you think it's the battery since it worked fine without it as
long as it was plugged in? I had this same "going blank" with the blinking
"-" in the upper left hand corner before and they were desktops. I don't
remember the exact figures anymore but to fix them, according to the shops
where I lived at the time, wasn't worth what it would cost. An XP and a
Vista both went the same way.
Shops may be right in that it may not be commercially viable for them to
make certain types of repairs, or for you to pay them to do so, but
probably they also hope that they can persuade you to buy a replacement
from their stock, while some repairs, a new battery is a good example, you
can do yourself economically.
This is true. They knew I would not buy from a small shop. I bought all our
past computers from CompUSA before they went under. One from Best Buy and
one from WalMart. I could usually get rid of problems like this by accessing
safe mode and doing as System Recovery or Restore. But nothing led to safe
mode.
Post by Java Jive
Post by HB
It wasn't dead when plugged in as info came up when I tapped F2 or F8 but
not safe mode. Nothing that showed was familiar to me. A repair tech would
know what the info meant but it was Chinese to me. So it didn't need a
battery to run. I hate to toss it because it's like new. No one liked it
because it was slow. I was hoping to do a system recovery but couldn't get
into safe mode. I don't know any other way to do a system restore or
recovery.
Most PCs can do some primitive diagnostics from the BIOS. The BIOS is
usually entered by pressing or holding down a particular key at a
particular stage in the boot process - favourites are <Del>, and either
<F10> or one of the other function keys across the top of the keyboard.
Again, going on to Toshiba's site and identifying the model number may
help you find out which key is the magic one. Some laptops, such as
Dells, can even perform full diagnostic tests by pressing a different
magic key, IIRC <F11>, but my memory for such intermittently used
information is getting a little dodgy these days, and anyway you have a
Toshiba, not a Dell, so it's likely to be a different key, if full
diagnostics are available at all.
I'll do some Googling again and see if I find anything helpful. I'm sure a
tech would have found those screens that came up helpful. To me they may as
well have been in Chinese.
Post by Java Jive
You may find this page on my site, useful - although when written I
mostly had desktops in mind, since writing it I've repaired some laptops
as well, and while the details may be different, the principles are
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/PCHardware/HardwareFaults.html
In particular, either ...
If the laptop can boot from a USB stick, then download an Ubuntu or other
Linux distro - make sure you get a suitable one, 32-bit or 64-bit as
appropriate - install it on a 2GB or larger USB stick, depending on the
size of the download, and see what messages Linux generates as it tries to
boot the PC. This may give you some useful pointers to a hardware fault.
If the PC boots from the stick, then you should see your hard disk
partition(s) as clickable icons down the left hand side menu (in Ubuntu,
other distros may be different, for example the icons may be on the
desktop). Try this and come back to us with a description of what
happens, particularly whether the PC boots at all, whether Linux lets see
your HD at all, and even the contents of it.
OK.. will do.



. you can mount the HD in a desktop, do that and diagnose it from
Post by Java Jive
there. If, as is likely with an old laptop, you have an IDE drive, you
would need a 2.5"-to-3.5" HD connector/convertor and attach the other side
of that to a spare IDE connector and power cable, whereas a SATA drive can
be attached directly to a standard SATA cable, but you may need a
convertor for the power cable - it all depends on the particular
combination of laptop HD and desktop motherboard and power supply cables.
Try this and do a chkdsk on the laptop's HD - you will probably have to
go into Disk Manager and give the laptop HD a drive letter first.
I wouldn't know where to start and if I want to devote the time it took to
do it. I've had almost no experience with the inside hardware of
computers. The HD doesn't look like anything I've seen in a DT PC. Just
getting to the wires to get the DT PC to come forward is a major
production... seriously. BTW, the HD is a Seagate 250 GBs - the other info
is all in Chinese characters.
Post by Java Jive
Either way, you should be able to find out if the HD can be retrieved by
repartitioning and reinstalling, and the first should also suggest whether
and how much of the rest of the PC is functioning correctly.
Wolf K
2018-03-11 15:39:22 UTC
Permalink
On 2018-03-11 06:11, HB wrote:

[...]
Post by HB
On the back it just says Satellite followed by numbers. I don't know which
numbers would be relevant. This is the 1st number. C655D (or 0) S5063 system
unit.
Use the whole thing first with the D, if that doesn't work, then with
the 0, for a search string. Start with "Toshiba". (Sheesh, do you really
need to be told that? Just experiment, fergawdssake!)
Post by HB
What makes you think it's the battery since it worked fine without it as
long as it was plugged in? > I had this same "going blank" with the blinking
"-" in the upper left hand corner before and they were desktops. I don't
remember the exact figures anymore but to fix them, according to the shops
where I lived at the time, wasn't worth what it would cost. An XP and a
Vista both went the same way.
It wasn't dead when plugged in as info came up when I tapped F2 or F8 but
not safe mode.
You've already been told that "safe mode" is in Windows, _not_ in the
computer. You can't get into safe mode until Windows is loaded. Which
isn't happening, right?
Post by HB
Nothing that showed was familiar to me.
Google it.
Post by HB
A repair tech would
know what the info meant but it was Chinese to me.
You either got a standard BIOS screen, which gives you options to
select, or you got an error message. Which was it? If it was an error
message, what did it say?
Post by HB
So it didn't need a
battery to run.
That's not a sound inference. Why? Because if it were "running", it
would load Windows. OTOH, if the disk drive is somehow corrupted, it
wouldn't load Windows, either. Without an error message, there's no way
of telling.

A tech could find out, but that would cost you. But maybe a the fee for
diagnosis would be worth it. At worst, it would confirm that the machine
is toast. At best, it would indicate what repair(s) would make it
functional again.
Post by HB
I hate to toss it because it's like new. No one liked it
because it was slow. I was hoping to do a system recovery but couldn't get
into safe mode. I don't know any other way to do a system restore or
recovery.
Well, if the machine won't load Windows, you can't do that. But if it
did load Windows, you wouldn't need to do it. So....

Without further information, there's no point continuing this thread.
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
"The next conference for the time travel design team will be held two
weeks ago."
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-03-11 16:02:31 UTC
Permalink
[]
Post by Wolf K
Post by HB
I hate to toss it because it's like new. No one liked it
because it was slow. I was hoping to do a system recovery but couldn't get
into safe mode. I don't know any other way to do a system restore or
recovery.
Well, if the machine won't load Windows, you can't do that. But if it
Not _strictly_ true; there are ways to do a system restore on the disc
from another machine. It's convoluted, and needs concentration, and is
easy to screw up by doing the wrong thing at the wrong stage. I'm not
sure _I_ could do it. See the archives of this 'group (and the XP one);
sorry, I can't remember search terms.
Post by Wolf K
did load Windows, you wouldn't need to do it. So....
Without further information, there's no point continuing this thread.
Certainly not with that attitude. Come on, give the guy some slack! I
know there are those who come here without adequate preparation *and
continue that way*, but I think this guy is genuine, just perhaps has a
little less experience than some of us/you; he seems to be doing his
best to answer questions, even keeping calm and answering those in a
tirade from Mayayana! Using a flamethrower is likely to drive away
newcomers, and we need them, if the 'group isn't to just remain as the
five or ten of us. (_I_ am not that knowledgeable - as my posts in the
last two weeks or so must show! - about Windows 7 as such.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

You cannot simply assume someone is honest just because they are not an MP.
Wolf K
2018-03-11 20:04:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
[]
Post by Wolf K
Post by HB
I hate to toss it because it's like new. No one liked it
because it was slow. I was hoping to do a system recovery but couldn't get
into safe mode.  I don't know any other way to do a system restore or
recovery.
Well, if the machine won't load Windows, you can't do that. But if it
Not _strictly_ true; there are ways to do a system restore on the disc
from another machine. It's convoluted, and needs concentration, and is
easy to screw up by doing the wrong thing at the wrong stage. I'm not
sure _I_ could do it. See the archives of this 'group (and the XP one);
sorry, I can't remember search terms.
If I read you correctly, you're saying an image copied from another
machine might restore the disk (if it is in fact the disk that's the
problem.) I agree, I wouldn't recommend OP try to do that.
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Post by Wolf K
did load Windows, you wouldn't need to do it. So....
Without further information, there's no point continuing this thread.
Certainly not with that attitude. Come on, give the guy some slack!
OK, should've said "If we can't get more information, we can't continue
trying to solve the problem."
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I
know there are those who come here without adequate preparation *and
continue that way*, but I think this guy is genuine, just perhaps has a
little less experience than some of us/you; he seems to be doing his
best to answer questions, even keeping calm and answering those in a
tirade from Mayayana! Using a flamethrower is likely to drive away
newcomers, and we need them, if the 'group isn't to just remain as the
five or ten of us. (_I_ am not that knowledgeable - as my posts in the
last two weeks or so must show! - about Windows 7 as such.)
What I meant was what we need the information that OP refers to but
doesn't quote/specify. I'm still not sure whether the machine boots on
external power with or without the battery. See Vanguard's post, which
is an attempt to get clarity on that question.
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
"The next conference for the time travel design team will be held two
weeks ago."
Patrick
2018-03-11 21:23:21 UTC
Permalink
I know there are those who come here without adequate preparation *and
continue that way*, but I think this guy is genuine, just perhaps has
a little less experience than some of us/you; he seems to be doing his
best to answer questions, even keeping calm and answering those in a
tirade from Mayayana! Using a flamethrower is likely to drive away
newcomers, and we need them, if the 'group isn't to just remain as the
five or ten of us. (_I_ am not that knowledgeable - as my posts in the
last two weeks or so must show! - about Windows 7 as such.)
 What I meant was what we need the information that OP refers to but
doesn't quote/specify. I'm still not sure whether the machine boots on
external power with or without the battery. See Vanguard's post, which
is an attempt to get clarity on that question.
From the numbers/details ascertained from the OP, the machine appears
to be this;

https://support.toshiba.com/support/modelHome?freeText=2743964
HB
2018-03-13 00:37:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wolf K
I know there are those who come here without adequate preparation *and
continue that way*, but I think this guy is genuine, just perhaps has a
little less experience than some of us/you; he seems to be doing his
best to answer questions, even keeping calm and answering those in a
tirade from Mayayana! Using a flamethrower is likely to drive away
newcomers, and we need them, if the 'group isn't to just remain as the
five or ten of us. (_I_ am not that knowledgeable - as my posts in the
last two weeks or so must show! - about Windows 7 as such.)
What I meant was what we need the information that OP refers to but
doesn't quote/specify. I'm still not sure whether the machine boots on
external power with or without the battery. See Vanguard's post, which is
an attempt to get clarity on that question.
From the numbers/details ascertained from the OP, the machine appears to
be this;
https://support.toshiba.com/support/modelHome?freeText=2743964
That sure looks like it. I'll check that site when I finish up here and
have free time later tonight.

J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-03-11 22:15:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wolf K
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
[]
Post by Wolf K
Post by HB
I hate to toss it because it's like new. No one liked it
because it was slow. I was hoping to do a system recovery but couldn't get
into safe mode.  I don't know any other way to do a system restore or
recovery.
Well, if the machine won't load Windows, you can't do that. But if it
Not _strictly_ true; there are ways to do a system restore on the
disc from another machine. It's convoluted, and needs concentration,
and is easy to screw up by doing the wrong thing at the wrong stage.
I'm not sure _I_ could do it. See the archives of this 'group (and
the XP one); sorry, I can't remember search terms.
If I read you correctly, you're saying an image copied from another
machine might restore the disk (if it is in fact the disk that's the
problem.) I agree, I wouldn't recommend OP try to do that.
No, I meant I remember seeing a way to get at previous restore points on
a disc that won't boot. It was something like: find the relevant files
(using another computer) in a directory with an obscure random-sounding
name, and save them; "repair" the system (in the faulty machine), such
that it creates initial as-new restore points; take the disc out again,
and replace (on the other computer) the as-new restore files with the
ones you've saved. I've probably missed some steps, or got them in the
wrong order; it's a while since I saw it described.
Post by Wolf K
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Post by Wolf K
did load Windows, you wouldn't need to do it. So....
Without further information, there's no point continuing this thread.
Certainly not with that attitude. Come on, give the guy some slack!
OK, should've said "If we can't get more information, we can't continue
trying to solve the problem."
Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
I know there are those who come here without adequate preparation
*and continue that way*, but I think this guy is genuine, just
perhaps has a little less experience than some of us/you; he seems to
be doing his best to answer questions, even keeping calm and
answering those in a tirade from Mayayana! Using a flamethrower is
likely to drive away newcomers, and we need them, if the 'group isn't
to just remain as the five or ten of us. (_I_ am not that
knowledgeable - as my posts in the last two weeks or so must show! -
about Windows 7 as such.)
What I meant was what we need the information that OP refers to but
doesn't quote/specify. I'm still not sure whether the machine boots on
external power with or without the battery.
I agree, I'm waiting for him to answer that one, as it's a simple thing
to try.
Post by Wolf K
See Vanguard's post, which is an attempt to get clarity on that
question.
I did see one - quite a rant! - from Vanguard, followed by one from this
guy which seemed to me to be a very patient response. Granted, he didn't
reply to all the questions Vanguard asked, but I think he answered
several of them.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

If you believe in telekinesis, raise my right hand
HB
2018-03-13 00:34:34 UTC
Permalink
"Wolf K" <***@sympatico.ca> wrote in message news:WYfpC.69714$***@fx21.iad...
-snip -
Post by Wolf K
What I meant was what we need the information that OP refers to but
doesn't quote/specify. I'm still not sure whether the machine boots on
external power with or without the battery. See Vanguard's post, which is
an attempt to get clarity on that question.
Let me clarify. I noticed the battery stopped charging maybe 3 weeks ago.
The battery looked to be at zero for days. If the cursor was placed on the
battery icon it read something like, "plugged in not charging". I figured
the battery bit the dust but it worked fine so anyone who wanted to use it
would plug it in, then turn it on. It would boot right up into windows and
run fine. Then one everning I did the same but the screen was black with
the blinking " - " in the upper left hand corner. I shut it off and started
it tapping the F8 key and some window came up with tech info but no choices
such as safe mode. One window came up and the choice was to do a memory
check which said memory was OK. I'm not sure which F key brought up that
window.

That's as far as I got with it. You know the rest.
VanguardLH
2018-03-11 18:02:35 UTC
Permalink
With the battery in, laptop won't boot. With the battery out, the
laptop boots. That how it appears you describe the problem. Did I get
your description wrong? If not, seems pretty simple diagnosis: it's the
battery.

Doesn't the laptop's own boot screen offer a choice to hit a special key
or key combo the restore the computer to factory-time setup?

https://support.toshiba.com/support/viewContentDetail?contentId=2737864

A special-use partition is created on the HDD to perform the factory
default installation. It is either an image to lay back on the HDD or
an installer to perform a default install. If the laptop didn't come
with recovery CDs, the manual probably mentioned how to create them
after you received the prebuilt computer.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2018-03-11 12:38:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by HB
Post by VanguardLH
Post by HB
When it rains it pours. The Toshiba LP W-7 64 went dark. It was fine, was
shut off and when I hit the On button a few days later, just a black screen
with a blinking " - " in the upper left-hand corner. Tapping the F8 is
supposed to bring up Safe Mode (as per Google) but instead up came a screen
to do a memory scan. After it finished I tried again and it came up with 6
tabs of technical info that's alien to me. None of the tabs were for Safe
Mode. I had no way to know what to do on any of the screens. Anyone know how
to get Safe Mode to come up on a Toshiba W-7?
Where do I go from here? The LP actually gets little use and is like new. I
hate to recycle it.
I sympathise. I hate to give up on a machine - often to well beyond its
worth, if I were to put a price on my time. I just don't like scrapping
things. (I certainly don't smash them up.)
Post by HB
Post by VanguardLH
Post by HB
I noticed a few days before that the battery wasn't charging. Since it was
almost always used plugged in, it didn't matter.
Some laptops won't run without a main battery installed. However, if
the main battery is dead, the laptop may not come up even when the
laptop's power adapter is plugged into A/C power. I'm not sure how the
circuitry is designed but I have seen some where the battery was used as
a capacitor in the power logic. If voltage regulation relies on a
I don't think those are common now though.
Post by HB
Post by VanguardLH
working main battery, try removing it. How old is the battery? Sounds
like it is too old and you need to replace it.
I don't _think_ your fault _is_ the battery, but _have_ you yet tried
booting it with the external power connected and the battery physically
removed? It's an easy thing to try.
Post by HB
It's the original battery. Was in the LT when relative gave it to me. BTW,
all it says on the Toshiba is Satalite. It's 64-bit.
Post by VanguardLH
F8 brings up the boot menu, not necessarily Windows safe mode. Once in
But even that boot menu is part of Windows, or at least part of what is
loaded from disc. Other options are other keys depending on model, and
_are_ part of the machine - the BIOS. (A long time ago, it was almost
always the delete key; then often one of the F keys. When I wanted to
change boot order recently on this Toshiba Protégé [to make an image], I
tried lots, and eventually had to download the manual, which told me it
was F12 _while_ turning the power on.) I think your system is not
getting as far as booting from disc as far as the boot menu, though why
that is we haven't determined yet.
[]
Post by HB
That's what I'm familiar with. Never saw that window yesterday. I finally
got a screen asking to insert the original CD. None exists so I guess I'm
out of options.
If it got that far, that message came from something loaded from the HD,
so the HD is at least working some of the time. It also _sounds_ like
the problem might be entirely software, i. e. some important OS file has
or files have been corrrupted. The call for the original CD means it was
going to lead you through recovery, which, depending on what has been
corrupted, might still be achievable with _an_ install CD rather than
_the_ official one; you might still be able to download one totally
appropriate to your machine, or more likely I'm sure you can get hold of
one (either by download or other means - even borrowing one) that would
_work_ even if not a total match.
Post by HB
Post by VanguardLH
However, that boot menu is presented by the kernel loader of Windows.
When you see the Advanced Options boot menu, you're already in Windows.
If Windows is corrupted, you might not get the F8 boot menu.
[]
Post by HB
The better half just said to remove the HD, give it a few good whacks with
the sledge hammer and dump them in the electronic recycle bin at the
Ouch. Don't give up yet.
Post by HB
dumpsters. I often take her advice. I appreciate everyone's time trying to
help.
I still think it's likely to be RAM, HD, or just corruption.

RAM - you were going to try reseating, cleaning, or ideally (but only
possible if there are more than one module) trying only one out of two.
If you want to _thouroughly_ check the RAM, it's easy, just takes time
(you don't have to be there though): if you download the best-known
test, which I think is called memtest86, it will actually fit on a
floppy (though as you are unlikely to have one can be put on a CD); this
is actually bootable from the floppy or CD, so will run without a hard
drive present at all: it is its own OS - it boots itself, then offers
you various tests on the RAM, which can run once or continuously; people
usually say run them for several hours or overnight. Since your fault
seems to be coming up fairly rapidly, I don't _think_ you'd need to do
_that_ thorough a test, though it might be worth doing more than the
minimum, as Windows may use the RAM in different ways.

Personally, I don't _think_ your RAM has "gone bad"; I've never had this
happen, though I certainly believe it can, and others here including
Paul have. I _have_ had them work loose, or get dirt in the contacts,
though.

HD: This is in some ways the most worrying possibility, as if it _is_
faulty, it's (especially from what you've described so far) likely to be
intermittent. Unless you're unlucky enough to have one of those laptops
where there isn't a cover over the HD, then take off the cover over the
HD, and listen - and perhaps feel - whether it's operating oddly (making
worrying noises, or vibrating oddly - or, sometimes not spinning up at
all). Difficult to tell by sound and feel, though, especially if you
haven't another machine to compare it to.

Depending on what you decide, and you may do the other things first,
other steps would be to take it out and connect it to another machine:
you're unlikely to have any other machine you can put it into as a
secondary drive (don't put it into a different machine as primary drive
and try to boot from it, that would likely corrupt things somewhat), so
that means either a desktop (best as you'd be going direct to the SATA),
or via some sort of USB interface. (Doesn't have to be a housing -
though the cheapest of those are cheaper than a "cable" or dock! - it
can be, indeed, a "cable" [these actually aren't just wires but have
electronics in them] or a dock.) _Ideally_, one with a separate power
supply, though housings may not have those. First, I'd then interrogate
the SMART data - that can be interrogated via a USB interface; there are
lots of utilities that will interrogate it (I use
https://www.passmark.com/products/diskcheckup.htm). Ideally, do it two
or more times, separated by a while, as you'll then see how things are
changing, if any are. (Several of the utilities, including the one I
use, will give you a predicted failure date if one of the important
parameters is worsening, though in a very simplistic manner as they just
use a straight-line prediction of when it'll fall below permissible -
I've had predicted dates like 2037! But it's useful to be able to see if
the parameters are changing.) You can also do assorted tests: how well
these will work through a USB link is variable, but they won't usually
do any _harm_. HDTune (if it works) will give (dropping) spikes; if
these are in the same place on two or more runs, they suggest a bad
patch. (Though if only one or two and they're narrow, that _can_ mean
there are faults, but they're being handled by the drive's own handling
mechanism, and can be lived with if they don't get worse. But keep an
eye on.)

Corruption: if it's just corruption of some important file, the main
concern is _how_ it happened: your description _implies_ you didn't shut
down improperly. However, increasingly with each version of Windows
(updates etc.) these can happen. Provided it's _not_ due to an
intermittent hardware fault, I suspect it can be restored no problem; at
worst (or perhaps one could say, least effort beyond a point), that
might involve reinstallation of Windows (though if it comes to that, use
the various utilities around to extract the product keys etc. first, if
you haven't got them), but I suspect, with the knowledge of those here,
that it needn't come to that. Use of the Recovery Console (from a CD if
necessary) would _probably_ suffice. [I said provided it's not due to
intermittent hardware; of course, even if it _is_, it should be
recoverable, but if that's the cause, it'll happen again.]

I _suspect_ the most likely fault, based on what you've described so
far, is corruption of one or more important files, followed by a loose
or dirty connection at the RAM or HD.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Security is the perfect excuse to lock you out of your own computer.
- Mayayana in alt.windows7.general, 2015-12-4
VanguardLH
2018-03-11 18:09:49 UTC
Permalink
VanguardLH wrote ...
Some laptops won't run without a [working] main battery installed.
I don't think those are common now though.
The OP isn't asking about recent hardware that is "common now". The OP
is asking about something that has sat in closet for many years while
its battery deteriorated and its CMOS battery died. Toshiba introduced
their Satellite family in the early 90's. As yet, we don't know what
model the OP has or its age.
If it got that far, that message came from something loaded from the HD,
so the HD is at least working some of the time. It also _sounds_ like
the problem might be entirely software, i. e. some important OS file has
or files have been corrrupted.
The HDD should be removable: open an access panel, remove a couple
screws (if used), and pull out the HDD. The laptop should boot to the
POST screen and then fail with a message saying the OS loader could not
be found. That would prove the laptop's hardware can do a cold boot.
Patrick
2018-03-11 21:17:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by HB
When it rains it pours. The Toshiba LP W-7 64 went dark. It was fine, was
shut off and when I hit the On button a few days later, just a black screen
with a blinking " - " in the upper left-hand corner. Tapping the F8 is
supposed to bring up Safe Mode (as per Google) but instead up came a screen
to do a memory scan. After it finished I tried again and it came up with 6
tabs of technical info that's alien to me. None of the tabs were for Safe
Mode. I had no way to know what to do on any of the screens. Anyone know how
to get Safe Mode to come up on a Toshiba W-7?
Where do I go from here? The LP actually gets little use and is like new. I
hate to recycle it.
I noticed a few days before that the battery wasn't charging. Since it was
almost always used plugged in, it didn't matter.
Does this look like the LapTop that you are refering to;

https://support.toshiba.com/support/modelHome?freeText=2743964
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