Discussion:
Denmark vs. Trump Land
(too old to reply)
Weatherman
2018-08-17 10:55:02 UTC
Permalink
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/

Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
G Ross
2018-08-17 14:47:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Where is Hilary when we need her?
--
G Ross
Fokke Nauta
2018-08-17 20:24:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
KenW
2018-08-17 21:20:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fokke Nauta
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
You ain't from this country so shut the F up
Weatherman
2018-08-18 08:20:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Post by Fokke Nauta
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
You ain't from this country so shut the F up
He's from this planet and has every right to state the truth about
Trump, the most dangerous thing to happen to this planet ever.
Tim Slattery
2018-08-18 15:43:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Post by Fokke Nauta
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
You ain't from this country so shut the F up
Lots of us in this country (USA) feel the same way.
--
Tim Slattery
tim <at> risingdove <dot> com
KenW
2018-08-18 17:28:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tim Slattery
Post by KenW
Post by Fokke Nauta
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
You ain't from this country so shut the F up
Lots of us in this country (USA) feel the same way.
Well I sure don't. My stocks/bonds are doing great, he is trying to
stop ILLEGAL immigration, building up the military and in general
trying to undo what the democrats have do to F**k up the country.
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the biased
news stations. Bet there is a load of news you have never heard about
and not only from FOX news. Obama did more harm to this country than
you will ever know because the Liberal news hides it. I hope to GOD
the Reps stay in power because Pelosi and Schumer will f**k everything
up or wait and see what happens if they win. One last thing "why does
the news & DEMONcrats' refuse to call it ILLEGAL IMMAGRATION..THINK
ABOUT


KenW
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-18 18:48:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Well I sure don't. My stocks/bonds are doing great, he is trying to
stop ILLEGAL immigration, building up the military and in general
trying to undo what the democrats have do to F**k up the country.
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the biased
news stations. Bet there is a load of news you have never heard about
and not only from FOX news. Obama did more harm to this country than
you will ever know because the Liberal news hides it. I hope to GOD
the Reps stay in power because Pelosi and Schumer will f**k everything
up or wait and see what happens if they win. One last thing "why does
the news & DEMONcrats' refuse to call it ILLEGAL IMMAGRATION..THINK
ABOUT
KenW, most of us don't watch FOX news for the same reason we don't
drink out of the toilet. We read multiple sources, we listen to the
man himself and we make our own judgments instead of having Hannity
and Ingrahm feed us Trump's propaganda.

Trump is a traitor, a criminal and an amoral scumbag.

Unlike you, I am not willing to sellout my country for a few dollars
that are actually borrowed from my descendants or to assuage bogus
racist fears. That is the precise formula employed by the Nazis in
the 1930s and you are a fool for not seeing it.
--
"Donald Trump's press conference performance in Helsinki rises to & exceeds the threshold of 'high crimes & misdemeanors.' It was nothing short of treasonous. Not only were Trump's comments imbecilic, he is wholly in the pocket of Putin. Republican Patriots: Where are you???"

-John Brennan, Director CIA, ret.
KenW
2018-08-18 18:58:30 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 11:48:21 -0700, Stormin' Norman
Post by Stormin' Norman
Post by KenW
Well I sure don't. My stocks/bonds are doing great, he is trying to
stop ILLEGAL immigration, building up the military and in general
trying to undo what the democrats have do to F**k up the country.
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the biased
news stations. Bet there is a load of news you have never heard about
and not only from FOX news. Obama did more harm to this country than
you will ever know because the Liberal news hides it. I hope to GOD
the Reps stay in power because Pelosi and Schumer will f**k everything
up or wait and see what happens if they win. One last thing "why does
the news & DEMONcrats' refuse to call it ILLEGAL IMMAGRATION..THINK
ABOUT
KenW, most of us don't watch FOX news for the same reason we don't
drink out of the toilet. We read multiple sources, we listen to the
man himself and we make our own judgments instead of having Hannity
and Ingrahm feed us Trump's propaganda.
Trump is a traitor, a criminal and an amoral scumbag.
Unlike you, I am not willing to sellout my country for a few dollars
that are actually borrowed from my descendants or to assuage bogus
racist fears. That is the precise formula employed by the Nazis in
the 1930s and you are a fool for not seeing it.
Cut the crap you a total liberal that believes very WRONG thing you
read. Don't like him I don't . He is doing a great job no matter you
say. NAZIS that is a bunch of your shit. Anyone that compares another
to them is a FUCKING IDIOT.
I wonder why I have been reading stuff you post. My SHIT list screwed
up. Anther AHOLE Kill filed.


KenW
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-18 19:21:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 11:48:21 -0700, Stormin' Norman
Post by Stormin' Norman
KenW, most of us don't watch FOX news for the same reason we don't
drink out of the toilet. We read multiple sources, we listen to the
man himself and we make our own judgments instead of having Hannity
and Ingrahm feed us Trump's propaganda.
Trump is a traitor, a criminal and an amoral scumbag.
Unlike you, I am not willing to sellout my country for a few dollars
that are actually borrowed from my descendants or to assuage bogus
racist fears. That is the precise formula employed by the Nazis in
the 1930s and you are a fool for not seeing it.
Cut the crap you a total liberal that believes very WRONG thing you
read. Don't like him I don't . He is doing a great job no matter you
say. NAZIS that is a bunch of your shit. Anyone that compares another
to them is a FUCKING IDIOT.
I wonder why I have been reading stuff you post. My SHIT list screwed
up. Anther AHOLE Kill filed.
LOL, Trump is certainly doing a "great job", for Vlad Putin. For the
United States and our allies, not so much. In fact, he is an abysmal
failure as POTUS.

As for the Nazis and any number of other totalitarian regimes and
leaders, those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

Wake up Ken, snap out of your stupor, wean yourself off of the FOX
Kool-aid.
--
"Without having some kind of tangible reasons for doing so,
which there may be that I’m not aware of, I don’t like it
at all. It just feels like sort of a... banana republic kind of thing,"

-Senator Bob Corker on the revocation of John Brennan's security clearance
Nil
2018-08-19 17:47:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Cut the crap you a total liberal that believes very WRONG thing
you read. Don't like him I don't . He is doing a great job no
matter you say. NAZIS that is a bunch of your shit. Anyone that
compares another to them is a FUCKING IDIOT.
I wonder why I have been reading stuff you post. My SHIT list
screwed up. Anther AHOLE Kill filed.
You're frothing. Please wipe up your spittle on your way out.
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-19 18:12:45 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 13:47:33 -0400, Nil
Post by Nil
Post by KenW
Cut the crap you a total liberal that believes very WRONG thing
you read. Don't like him I don't . He is doing a great job no
matter you say. NAZIS that is a bunch of your shit. Anyone that
compares another to them is a FUCKING IDIOT.
I wonder why I have been reading stuff you post. My SHIT list
screwed up. Anther AHOLE Kill filed.
You're frothing. Please wipe up your spittle on your way out.
LOL!
--
"Mr. Trump’s claims of no collusion are, in a word, hogwash,"

-John Brennan Director CIA ret. (August 2018)
Johnny
2018-08-18 19:28:05 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 11:48:21 -0700
Post by Stormin' Norman
Post by KenW
Well I sure don't. My stocks/bonds are doing great, he is trying to
stop ILLEGAL immigration, building up the military and in general
trying to undo what the democrats have do to F**k up the country.
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the
biased news stations. Bet there is a load of news you have never
heard about and not only from FOX news. Obama did more harm to this
country than you will ever know because the Liberal news hides it. I
hope to GOD the Reps stay in power because Pelosi and Schumer will
f**k everything up or wait and see what happens if they win. One
last thing "why does the news & DEMONcrats' refuse to call it
ILLEGAL IMMAGRATION..THINK ABOUT
KenW, most of us don't watch FOX news for the same reason we don't
drink out of the toilet. We read multiple sources, we listen to the
man himself and we make our own judgments instead of having Hannity
and Ingrahm feed us Trump's propaganda.
Trump is a traitor, a criminal and an amoral scumbag.
Unlike you, I am not willing to sellout my country for a few dollars
that are actually borrowed from my descendants or to assuage bogus
racist fears. That is the precise formula employed by the Nazis in
the 1930s and you are a fool for not seeing it.
I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
Hillary had won, it would have been accepted, and that would have been
the end of it.

I was surprised as anyone to wake up and find out Trump won.

I have heard people call him a racist from day one, and I have seen no
one offer any proof.

He is no worse than Bill Clinton when it comes to being an amoral
scumbag, but I didn't see the Democrats calling Bill Clinton those
names.

Trump is not a criminal, he is not being investigated. The
investigation is about Russian collusion to keep Hillary from winning,
when it should be about who paid for the British spy to get dirt on
Trump to start this phony investigation.

Calling him a traitor is just a lie.

By the way, it's good to see you posting again.
KenW
2018-08-18 20:24:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 11:48:21 -0700
Post by Stormin' Norman
Post by KenW
Well I sure don't. My stocks/bonds are doing great, he is trying to
stop ILLEGAL immigration, building up the military and in general
trying to undo what the democrats have do to F**k up the country.
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the
biased news stations. Bet there is a load of news you have never
heard about and not only from FOX news. Obama did more harm to this
country than you will ever know because the Liberal news hides it. I
hope to GOD the Reps stay in power because Pelosi and Schumer will
f**k everything up or wait and see what happens if they win. One
last thing "why does the news & DEMONcrats' refuse to call it
ILLEGAL IMMAGRATION..THINK ABOUT
KenW, most of us don't watch FOX news for the same reason we don't
drink out of the toilet. We read multiple sources, we listen to the
man himself and we make our own judgments instead of having Hannity
and Ingrahm feed us Trump's propaganda.
Trump is a traitor, a criminal and an amoral scumbag.
Unlike you, I am not willing to sellout my country for a few dollars
that are actually borrowed from my descendants or to assuage bogus
racist fears. That is the precise formula employed by the Nazis in
the 1930s and you are a fool for not seeing it.
I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
Hillary had won, it would have been accepted, and that would have been
the end of it.
I was surprised as anyone to wake up and find out Trump won.
I have heard people call him a racist from day one, and I have seen no
one offer any proof.
He is no worse than Bill Clinton when it comes to being an amoral
scumbag, but I didn't see the Democrats calling Bill Clinton those
names.
Trump is not a criminal, he is not being investigated. The
investigation is about Russian collusion to keep Hillary from winning,
when it should be about who paid for the British spy to get dirt on
Trump to start this phony investigation.
Calling him a traitor is just a lie.
By the way, it's good to see you posting again.
I agree


KenW
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-18 22:07:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
Hillary had won, it would have been accepted, and that would have been
the end of it.
I was surprised as anyone to wake up and find out Trump won.
"Give the man a chance", good one. ;-)
Post by Johnny
I have heard people call him a racist from day one, and I have seen no
one offer any proof.
Then you have not been reading the news, his tweets or listening to
what he says.
Post by Johnny
He is no worse than Bill Clinton when it comes to being an amoral
scumbag, but I didn't see the Democrats calling Bill Clinton those
names.
Ahh, the "Whataboutism" defense. Newsflash, Bill Clinton was
impeached basically for lying about getting a blowjob from Lewinsky.
Trump will be impeached or indicted (and convicted) for giving a
blowjob to Vladimir Putin and defrauding the United States of America,
amongst many other charges from emoluments, money laundering and
obstruction of justice to abuse of authority.
Post by Johnny
Trump is not a criminal, he is not being investigated.
Trump is being investigated by a number of jurisdictions from the
state of New York to the United States of America. Trump has not been
named a target in the Mueller investigation but he is a person of
interest, which places him a whisker away from being a target.
Post by Johnny
The
investigation is about Russian collusion to keep Hillary from winning,
when it should be about who paid for the British spy to get dirt on
Trump to start this phony investigation.
Phony investigation? a ty govorish' po russki?

Manafort, Trump campaign chairman facing life in prison. Flynn,
convicted of lying to FBI, Gates deputy campaign chair, convicted,
Popadopoulis, convicted, 25 Russians indicted, etc, etc, yeah,
"phony".
Post by Johnny
Calling him a traitor is just a lie.
Not at all, he simply has not been convicted of treason, yet. That
does not mean he isn't a traitor.

Donald Trump is so crooked, if he swallowed a nail, he would shit a
corkscrew.
--
"Mr. Trump’s claims of no collusion are, in a word, hogwash,"

-John Brennan Director CIA ret. (August 2018)
Johnny
2018-08-18 22:19:12 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 15:07:36 -0700
Post by Stormin' Norman
Post by Johnny
I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
Hillary had won, it would have been accepted, and that would have
been the end of it.
I was surprised as anyone to wake up and find out Trump won.
"Give the man a chance", good one. ;-)
Post by Johnny
I have heard people call him a racist from day one, and I have seen
no one offer any proof.
Then you have not been reading the news, his tweets or listening to
what he says.
Post by Johnny
He is no worse than Bill Clinton when it comes to being an amoral
scumbag, but I didn't see the Democrats calling Bill Clinton those
names.
Ahh, the "Whataboutism" defense. Newsflash, Bill Clinton was
impeached basically for lying about getting a blowjob from Lewinsky.
Trump will be impeached or indicted (and convicted) for giving a
blowjob to Vladimir Putin and defrauding the United States of America,
amongst many other charges from emoluments, money laundering and
obstruction of justice to abuse of authority.
Post by Johnny
Trump is not a criminal, he is not being investigated.
Trump is being investigated by a number of jurisdictions from the
state of New York to the United States of America. Trump has not been
named a target in the Mueller investigation but he is a person of
interest, which places him a whisker away from being a target.
Post by Johnny
The
investigation is about Russian collusion to keep Hillary from
winning, when it should be about who paid for the British spy to get
dirt on Trump to start this phony investigation.
Phony investigation? a ty govorish' po russki?
Manafort, Trump campaign chairman facing life in prison. Flynn,
convicted of lying to FBI, Gates deputy campaign chair, convicted,
Popadopoulis, convicted, 25 Russians indicted, etc, etc, yeah,
"phony".
Post by Johnny
Calling him a traitor is just a lie.
Not at all, he simply has not been convicted of treason, yet. That
does not mean he isn't a traitor.
That's the problem with people that think like you. You have already
convicted him with out a trial. If a Grand Jury failed to indict him,
you would say they were paid off.

There is no way of reasoning with a liberal, so I'm through with this.
KenW
2018-08-18 22:55:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 15:07:36 -0700
Post by Stormin' Norman
Post by Johnny
I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
Hillary had won, it would have been accepted, and that would have
been the end of it.
I was surprised as anyone to wake up and find out Trump won.
"Give the man a chance", good one. ;-)
Post by Johnny
I have heard people call him a racist from day one, and I have seen
no one offer any proof.
Then you have not been reading the news, his tweets or listening to
what he says.
Post by Johnny
He is no worse than Bill Clinton when it comes to being an amoral
scumbag, but I didn't see the Democrats calling Bill Clinton those
names.
Ahh, the "Whataboutism" defense. Newsflash, Bill Clinton was
impeached basically for lying about getting a blowjob from Lewinsky.
Trump will be impeached or indicted (and convicted) for giving a
blowjob to Vladimir Putin and defrauding the United States of America,
amongst many other charges from emoluments, money laundering and
obstruction of justice to abuse of authority.
Post by Johnny
Trump is not a criminal, he is not being investigated.
Trump is being investigated by a number of jurisdictions from the
state of New York to the United States of America. Trump has not been
named a target in the Mueller investigation but he is a person of
interest, which places him a whisker away from being a target.
Post by Johnny
The
investigation is about Russian collusion to keep Hillary from
winning, when it should be about who paid for the British spy to get
dirt on Trump to start this phony investigation.
Phony investigation? a ty govorish' po russki?
Manafort, Trump campaign chairman facing life in prison. Flynn,
convicted of lying to FBI, Gates deputy campaign chair, convicted,
Popadopoulis, convicted, 25 Russians indicted, etc, etc, yeah,
"phony".
Post by Johnny
Calling him a traitor is just a lie.
Not at all, he simply has not been convicted of treason, yet. That
does not mean he isn't a traitor.
That's the problem with people that think like you. You have already
convicted him with out a trial. If a Grand Jury failed to indict him,
you would say they were paid off.
There is no way of reasoning with a liberal, so I'm through with this.
+1000


KenW
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-18 23:25:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 15:07:36 -0700
Post by Stormin' Norman
Post by Johnny
I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
Hillary had won, it would have been accepted, and that would have
been the end of it.
I was surprised as anyone to wake up and find out Trump won.
"Give the man a chance", good one. ;-)
Post by Johnny
I have heard people call him a racist from day one, and I have seen
no one offer any proof.
Then you have not been reading the news, his tweets or listening to
what he says.
Post by Johnny
He is no worse than Bill Clinton when it comes to being an amoral
scumbag, but I didn't see the Democrats calling Bill Clinton those
names.
Ahh, the "Whataboutism" defense. Newsflash, Bill Clinton was
impeached basically for lying about getting a blowjob from Lewinsky.
Trump will be impeached or indicted (and convicted) for giving a
blowjob to Vladimir Putin and defrauding the United States of America,
amongst many other charges from emoluments, money laundering and
obstruction of justice to abuse of authority.
Post by Johnny
Trump is not a criminal, he is not being investigated.
Trump is being investigated by a number of jurisdictions from the
state of New York to the United States of America. Trump has not been
named a target in the Mueller investigation but he is a person of
interest, which places him a whisker away from being a target.
Post by Johnny
The
investigation is about Russian collusion to keep Hillary from
winning, when it should be about who paid for the British spy to get
dirt on Trump to start this phony investigation.
Phony investigation? a ty govorish' po russki?
Manafort, Trump campaign chairman facing life in prison. Flynn,
convicted of lying to FBI, Gates deputy campaign chair, convicted,
Popadopoulis, convicted, 25 Russians indicted, etc, etc, yeah,
"phony".
Post by Johnny
Calling him a traitor is just a lie.
Not at all, he simply has not been convicted of treason, yet. That
does not mean he isn't a traitor.
That's the problem with people that think like you. You have already
convicted him with out a trial. If a Grand Jury failed to indict him,
you would say they were paid off.
There is no way of reasoning with a liberal, so I'm through with this.
ROFL, we are all witnesses to history. When I witness someone
betraying my country, the USA, I don't need the Senate, a jury or a
Grand Jury to indict or convict that person to know they are a
traitor, based upon the evidence I have witnessed.

The same way you pronounced Bill Clinton an amoral scumbag above, even
though he was acquitted, I am able to pronounce Donald Trump a
traitor, among other things.
--
"Mr. Trump’s claims of no collusion are, in a word, hogwash,"

-John Brennan Director CIA ret. (August 2018)
Mayayana
2018-08-18 22:41:03 UTC
Permalink
"Johnny" <***@invalid.net> wrote

| I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
| Hillary had won...

Hasn't he had a chance? I think Hillary is a dishonest
opportunist and a fake Democrat. You can't be liberal
and still be funded by Wall St. I'm also not very political.
But I still see disaster and denial in Trump. He's been
appointing people to break gov't. He helped push a
big tax break for the rich. Basically, he got the key to the
store and he's grabbing what he can for himself and his
friends. His vision doesn't extend beyond that. I see
nothing more than a thug. I haven't seen any evidence
to the contrary.

If you're rich, a plutocrat, don't believe global
warming is a problem, and don't think the FDA or other
citizen protections are relevant, and you also don't
think you owe it to your fellow citizens to help the poor
or disabled, then Trump is the obvious choice. For
anyone else, not so much.

The sad thing is that most Trump supporters
are not rich and never will be. They just hope beyond
hope that Trump will help them get their foot in the
door of wealth. Fat chance of that. You can't cut taxes
for the rich and still expect the working class and
middle class to do better. It just doesn't add up.

Whether or not Hillary would have been good has
nothing to do with it. It's a country and a society,
not a sporting event.
Johnny
2018-08-18 22:56:53 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 18:41:03 -0400
Post by Mayayana
| I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
| Hillary had won...
Hasn't he had a chance? I think Hillary is a dishonest
opportunist and a fake Democrat. You can't be liberal
and still be funded by Wall St. I'm also not very political.
But I still see disaster and denial in Trump. He's been
appointing people to break gov't. He helped push a
big tax break for the rich. Basically, he got the key to the
store and he's grabbing what he can for himself and his
friends. His vision doesn't extend beyond that. I see
nothing more than a thug. I haven't seen any evidence
to the contrary.
One of the first things he did was get the U.S out of the Trans-Pacific
Partnership. and he is renegotiating NAFTA. Those are big
accomplishments, and help the American workers. With Hillary, NAFTA
would remain the same, and we would be a member of the TPP, which would
benefit the rich.
KenW
2018-08-18 23:03:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 18:41:03 -0400
Post by Mayayana
| I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
| Hillary had won...
Hasn't he had a chance? I think Hillary is a dishonest
opportunist and a fake Democrat. You can't be liberal
and still be funded by Wall St. I'm also not very political.
But I still see disaster and denial in Trump. He's been
appointing people to break gov't. He helped push a
big tax break for the rich. Basically, he got the key to the
store and he's grabbing what he can for himself and his
friends. His vision doesn't extend beyond that. I see
nothing more than a thug. I haven't seen any evidence
to the contrary.
One of the first things he did was get the U.S out of the Trans-Pacific
Partnership. and he is renegotiating NAFTA. Those are big
accomplishments, and help the American workers. With Hillary, NAFTA
would remain the same, and we would be a member of the TPP, which would
benefit the rich.
Some complain that the 'rich' are getting more $ from the change in
taxes. What they don't understand is if you make $500k you will see
more than someone making $30k


KenW
Mayayana
2018-08-19 01:46:43 UTC
Permalink
"Johnny" <***@invalid.net> wrote

| One of the first things he did was get the U.S out of the Trans-Pacific
| Partnership. and he is renegotiating NAFTA. Those are big
| accomplishments, and help the American workers.

Maybe. But that's yet to be seen. You're picking
one thing that might turn out well, but haven't
answered the other issues. And the tariffs, so far,
don't seem to be working out so well for American
workers. Meanwhile, what's the status on NAFTA?
Personally I actually have no idea. But nothing much
seems to have happened as far as I know. Do you
really think it will? US businesses are exploiting
cheap labor over the border. When NAFTA passed,
Hewlett Packard had a factory in Mexico ready
to go online within a week. They were counting on
it. Thanks to the fake Democrat Clintons. Do you
really think Trump is better and that he's going to
screw those companies? I think he's more likely
to demand kickbacks in order to keep things the
way they are.

You mentioned illegal immigrants? Who do you think
benefits from illegal immigrants? Rich business owners.
It's the closest thing we've got to slave labor. Without
them, housecleaning, landscaping, agriculture and a
lot of factory work would collapse. The gov't could stop
it all overnight. But that won't happen. Who would turn
down the beds in Trump's hotels? Who would pick the
fruit in southern California? This has gone on for decades.
I was picking fruit in ME, AZ and CA in the 70s. It was
the same then. It didn't pay because farmers were able
to get illegal or semi-legal immigrants to do the work,
making the bogus claim that Americans wouldn't do the
work. Americans aren't lazy. They'll work if they get paid
fairly.

If you think Trump has any intention of stopping illegal
immigration then you've been had. Do you really think
he'd rather pay you a good wage and union benefits when
he can get a "wetback" for pennies on the dollar?

I'm a building contractor. When I started out in the
80s, subcontractors were American. Today it's hard to
find one. Plasterers used to be Italian Americans. Now
they're illegal Brazilians. On one job, the vinyl siding was
contracted by a Russian, whose crew was Ecuadoran.
All family men, sending their money home to support
families in Ecuador.
What if you were siding your house? Would you hire
the American for $9K or the illegal immigrant crew for
$6K? That's why they're here and that's why it's not
going to stop. They're not exploiting us. We're exploiting
them. Any police in any town in the US could
arrest illegals tomorrow at most any job site. But they
won't because the economy depends on exploiting them.

And that's made manual labor impossible to do at a
livable wage. (See Barbara Ehrenreich's Nickled and Dimed
book for a vivid portrayal of that.)

Personally I don't see so much difference between
liberals and conservatives. One tips toward socialism
while the other tips toward monarchy. They both make
valid points. But they're both the same in their
dogmatism, cherrypicking the facts to make their case.


| With Hillary.....

There you go again. It's not a contest between Hillary
and Trump. You're not on one team against another.
You're an American. Trump is your president. Hillary's gone.
If you're going to make your case for Trump on the basis
of, "Hillary would have been worse" then that's not much
of a case.

Don't you care that Trump's working to remove FDA
oversight? Don't you care that he's trying to destroy the
EPA? Don't you care that his education secretary is
opposed to public schools? He's systematically trying
to block the functioning of gov't agencies. And he's
against net neutrality. You don't care about that,
either? Do you live in a dumpster where the only thing
you can afford to care about is the dubious promise of
more jobs?
Johnny
2018-08-19 14:30:47 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 21:46:43 -0400
Post by Mayayana
| One of the first things he did was get the U.S out of the
Trans-Pacific | Partnership. and he is renegotiating NAFTA. Those
are big | accomplishments, and help the American workers.
Maybe. But that's yet to be seen. You're picking
one thing that might turn out well, but haven't
answered the other issues. And the tariffs, so far,
don't seem to be working out so well for American
workers. Meanwhile, what's the status on NAFTA?
Personally I actually have no idea. But nothing much
seems to have happened as far as I know. Do you
really think it will? US businesses are exploiting
cheap labor over the border. When NAFTA passed,
Hewlett Packard had a factory in Mexico ready
to go online within a week. They were counting on
it. Thanks to the fake Democrat Clintons. Do you
really think Trump is better and that he's going to
screw those companies? I think he's more likely
to demand kickbacks in order to keep things the
way they are.
NAFTA

Mr. Trump has repeatedly threatened to walk away from the trade pact if
it cannot be renegotiated in the United States’ favor, a position that
has put him at odds with many in the business community and Congress,
who see trade with Mexico and Canada as integral to industries as
varied as manufacturing, agriculture and energy. The auto industry, in
particular, has arranged its North American supply chains around the
deal’s terms.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/29/us/politics/nafta-talks-conclude-in-montreal-with-signs-of-progress-and-risk.html

As for the tariffs, we will just have to wait and see. That's one
reason I said to give the man a chance. I think it's important to stop
the government subsidized steel from China being sold to the United
States. Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
Post by Mayayana
You mentioned illegal immigrants? Who do you think
benefits from illegal immigrants? Rich business owners.
I don't think I mentioned illegal immigrants, but illegal immigration
should have been stopped forty of fifty years ago. It's caused by
greedy business men, and farmers.

I do think Trump is trying to stop it. He has started building The
Wall, but the Democrats refuse to fund it.
Post by Mayayana
It's the closest thing we've got to slave labor. Without
them, housecleaning, landscaping, agriculture and a
lot of factory work would collapse. The gov't could stop
it all overnight. But that won't happen. Who would turn
down the beds in Trump's hotels? Who would pick the
fruit in southern California? This has gone on for decades.
I was picking fruit in ME, AZ and CA in the 70s. It was
the same then. It didn't pay because farmers were able
to get illegal or semi-legal immigrants to do the work,
making the bogus claim that Americans wouldn't do the
work. Americans aren't lazy. They'll work if they get paid
fairly.
If you think Trump has any intention of stopping illegal
immigration then you've been had. Do you really think
he'd rather pay you a good wage and union benefits when
he can get a "wetback" for pennies on the dollar?
Trump has built his hotels and Casinos with union and non-union labor.
The non-union contractors on the jobs are the ones hiring illegal
immigrants to do the work. ICE has finally started workplace raids
again.
Post by Mayayana
I'm a building contractor. When I started out in the
80s, subcontractors were American. Today it's hard to
find one. Plasterers used to be Italian Americans. Now
they're illegal Brazilians. On one job, the vinyl siding was
contracted by a Russian, whose crew was Ecuadoran.
All family men, sending their money home to support
families in Ecuador.
What if you were siding your house? Would you hire
the American for $9K or the illegal immigrant crew for
$6K? That's why they're here and that's why it's not
going to stop. They're not exploiting us. We're exploiting
them. Any police in any town in the US could
arrest illegals tomorrow at most any job site. But they
won't because the economy depends on exploiting them.
The police won't do anything in cities controlled by a liberal mayor
and city council.
Post by Mayayana
And that's made manual labor impossible to do at a
livable wage. (See Barbara Ehrenreich's Nickled and Dimed
book for a vivid portrayal of that.)
Yes it has, and that's the reason so many young adults have turned to
crime. They have no opportunity to go to a trade school, and get a
good paying job that offers retirement and health benefits. That's why
I can't understand Black politicians supporting illegal immigrants.
Post by Mayayana
Personally I don't see so much difference between
liberals and conservatives. One tips toward socialism
while the other tips toward monarchy. They both make
valid points. But they're both the same in their
dogmatism, cherrypicking the facts to make their case.
| With Hillary.....
There you go again. It's not a contest between Hillary
and Trump. You're not on one team against another.
You're an American. Trump is your president. Hillary's gone.
If you're going to make your case for Trump on the basis
of, "Hillary would have been worse" then that's not much
of a case.
I think it's a good way to show the difference in political parties.
If Trump hadn't been elected, we would have never known the FBI and DOJ
were plotting to stop Trump from being elected, and took out an
insurance policy to remove him from office if he was elected.

He exposed their corruption for the whole world to see, and that's a
good thing.
Post by Mayayana
Don't you care that Trump's working to remove FDA
oversight? Don't you care that he's trying to destroy the
EPA? Don't you care that his education secretary is
opposed to public schools? He's systematically trying
to block the functioning of gov't agencies. And he's
against net neutrality. You don't care about that,
either? Do you live in a dumpster where the only thing
you can afford to care about is the dubious promise of
more jobs?
I do care about net neutrality.

Trump signed The Right to Try bill for terminally ill people, and I
think they should have that choice. The bill passed the Senate
unanimously, and the House along party lines.

I'm opposed to public schools, but there is no other choice at the
time. The teachers are not qualified to teach, and children come out
of high school practically illiterate.

At least I have an extension cord and a telephone line run to my
dumpster so I can post this message.
Mayayana
2018-08-19 15:30:17 UTC
Permalink
"Johnny" <***@invalid.net> wrote
At least I have an extension cord and a telephone line run to my
dumpster so I can post this message.
:) At least you have a sense of humor. I hope
it all works out as well as you're expecting.
Wolf K
2018-08-19 16:33:53 UTC
Permalink
On 2018-08-19 10:30, Johnny wrote:
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]

I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade deficit
is bad?
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
Do you know what they call alternative medicine that’s been proven to
work? Medicine. (T. Minchin)
Johnny
2018-08-19 17:04:26 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 12:33:53 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]
I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade
deficit is bad?
I'm not an economist, so I will have to go along with the president on
this. Do you think it's good to have a 375 billion dollar deficit
with China?
Wolf K
2018-08-20 00:55:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 12:33:53 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]
I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade
deficit is bad?
I'm not an economist, so I will have to go along with the president on
this.
Donald Trump isn't an economist either, so why woluld you go along with
him on this?

He thinks that foreign trade is about making money. It isn't. It's about
finding the stuff you need or want that you can't find in your own
country, or is cheaper or of better quality than in your own country.
Money is just a way of keeping track of the trades.

? Do you think it's good to have a 375 billion dollar deficit
Post by Johnny
with China?
Depends. What it means is that they have a $375 billion dollar _credit_
with the USA. Whether that's good or bad depends on whether the USA has
stuff China wants. In fact, China wants US soybeans: most of the
soybeans grown in the US have been sold to China. China has put a tariff
on US soybean imports, which means Chinese people have to pay more for
US soybeans. So naturally they will look for cheaper soybeans elsewhere.
If the tariffs are in place for more than a year or two, other
suppliers, such as Canada, will grow more soybeans, which means that
part of the soybean market for US farmers will be lost forever.

The reason China has been selling so much stuff to the USA is that
Americans want high wages, which makes American-made stuff expensive.
But Americans also want lots of stuff, which means they want cheap
stuff. Sam Walton supplied that need. If you really want to reduce the
deficit with China, stop shopping at Walmart.

Economics has been called "the dismal science". Now maybe you can see
why: economists have this nasty habit of telling you can't have what you
at the price you want.

Have a good day,
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
Do you know what they call alternative medicine that’s been proven to
work? Medicine. (T. Minchin)
Johnny
2018-08-20 09:39:26 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 20:55:36 -0400
Post by Wolf K
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 12:33:53 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]
I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade
deficit is bad?
I'm not an economist, so I will have to go along with the president
on this.
Donald Trump isn't an economist either, so why woluld you go along
with him on this?
Because the president thinks he has a solution to the problem of
manufacturing jobs being lost to China and Mexico. Hopefully the
tariffs will cause American companies to stop moving production
overseas, and produce their products here. The economists have no
solution, all they can do is tell you what is happening and why.
Post by Wolf K
He thinks that foreign trade is about making money. It isn't. It's
about finding the stuff you need or want that you can't find in your
own country, or is cheaper or of better quality than in your own
country. Money is just a way of keeping track of the trades.
? Do you think it's good to have a 375 billion dollar deficit
Post by Johnny
with China?
Depends. What it means is that they have a $375 billion dollar
_credit_ with the USA. Whether that's good or bad depends on whether
the USA has stuff China wants. In fact, China wants US soybeans: most
of the soybeans grown in the US have been sold to China. China has
put a tariff on US soybean imports, which means Chinese people have
to pay more for US soybeans. So naturally they will look for cheaper
soybeans elsewhere. If the tariffs are in place for more than a year
or two, other suppliers, such as Canada, will grow more soybeans,
which means that part of the soybean market for US farmers will be
lost forever.
The reason China has been selling so much stuff to the USA is that
Americans want high wages, which makes American-made stuff expensive.
But Americans also want lots of stuff, which means they want cheap
stuff. Sam Walton supplied that need. If you really want to reduce
the deficit with China, stop shopping at Walmart.
Economics has been called "the dismal science". Now maybe you can see
why: economists have this nasty habit of telling you can't have what
you at the price you want.
Have a good day,
Wolf K
2018-08-20 14:06:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 20:55:36 -0400
Post by Wolf K
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 12:33:53 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]
I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade
deficit is bad?
I'm not an economist, so I will have to go along with the president
on this.
Donald Trump isn't an economist either, so why woluld you go along
with him on this?
Because the president thinks he has a solution to the problem of
manufacturing jobs being lost to China and Mexico.
The President's expertise is in real estate deals, not in
manufacturing. Eg, he did (and probably still doesn't) know that most
"foreign" cars sold in the USA are wholly or partly assembled in the
USA. BMW's biggest assembly plant is in Kentucky, and about 3/4 of its
output is sold overseas.
Post by Johnny
Hopefully the
tariffs will cause American companies to stop moving production
overseas, and produce their products here. The economists have no
solution, all they can do is tell you what is happening and why.
Economists will tell what will happen if you make certain choices. For
example, higher tariffs on imports will result in higher prices for
consumers. Depending on where the existing efficiencies in production
already are, it will result in higher profits for corporations.

For example, tariffs on "foreign" steel and aluminum will result in
higher costs for US manufacturers, who are already complaining about that.
Post by Johnny
Post by Wolf K
He thinks that foreign trade is about making money. It isn't. It's
about finding the stuff you need or want that you can't find in your
own country, or is cheaper or of better quality than in your own
country. Money is just a way of keeping track of the trades.
? Do you think it's good to have a 375 billion dollar deficit
Post by Johnny
with China?
Depends. What it means is that they have a $375 billion dollar
_credit_ with the USA. Whether that's good or bad depends on whether
the USA has stuff China wants. In fact, China wants US soybeans: most
of the soybeans grown in the US have been sold to China. China has
put a tariff on US soybean imports, which means Chinese people have
to pay more for US soybeans. So naturally they will look for cheaper
soybeans elsewhere. If the tariffs are in place for more than a year
or two, other suppliers, such as Canada, will grow more soybeans,
which means that part of the soybean market for US farmers will be
lost forever.
The reason China has been selling so much stuff to the USA is that
Americans want high wages, which makes American-made stuff expensive.
But Americans also want lots of stuff, which means they want cheap
stuff. Sam Walton supplied that need. If you really want to reduce
the deficit with China, stop shopping at Walmart.
Economics has been called "the dismal science". Now maybe you can see
why: economists have this nasty habit of telling you can't have what
you at the price you want.
No thoughts about the above? For example, how much more are you willing
to pay so that your under-employed neighbour can work at a good-paying job?

Have a good day,
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
Do you know what they call alternative medicine that’s been proven to
work? Medicine. (T. Minchin)
Frank Slootweg
2018-08-20 15:08:20 UTC
Permalink
Wolf K <***@sympatico.ca> wrote:
[...]
Post by Wolf K
Economists will tell what will happen if you make certain choices. For
example, higher tariffs on imports will result in higher prices for
consumers. Depending on where the existing efficiencies in production
already are, it will result in higher profits for corporations.
For example, tariffs on "foreign" steel and aluminum will result in
higher costs for US manufacturers, who are already complaining about that.
Exactly. A single accross-the-board tariff for - for example - steel,
is stupid, because there just isn't one type/quality of steel, but many,
many different ones.

So US manufacturers - and hence customers/consumers - pay more for
certain types of steel they *have* to import - for example from our
country, The Netherlands, because the US steel industry can't/doesn't
produce it.

So in this case, Trump's narrow-minded actions, do *not* benefit the
US steel industry/workers, *does* hurt the affected US manufacturers/
customers/consumer and does hurt the producing country a bit. So
everybody loses.

Great way of shooting yourself *and* your partners in the feet!

N.B. Steel is just one example. The problem occurs for nearly all if
not all products which are slapped with a tariff.

And then we have the countermeasures from the affected countries,
which will and do strike back. Example: Making Harley Davidson moving
part of its manufacturing *out* of the US.

Moral: In trade-wars everybody loses.
Char Jackson
2018-08-20 16:01:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Frank Slootweg
[...]
Post by Wolf K
Economists will tell what will happen if you make certain choices. For
example, higher tariffs on imports will result in higher prices for
consumers. Depending on where the existing efficiencies in production
already are, it will result in higher profits for corporations.
For example, tariffs on "foreign" steel and aluminum will result in
higher costs for US manufacturers, who are already complaining about that.
Exactly. A single accross-the-board tariff for - for example - steel,
is stupid, because there just isn't one type/quality of steel, but many,
many different ones.
So US manufacturers - and hence customers/consumers - pay more for
certain types of steel they *have* to import - for example from our
country, The Netherlands, because the US steel industry can't/doesn't
produce it.
So in this case, Trump's narrow-minded actions, do *not* benefit the
US steel industry/workers, *does* hurt the affected US manufacturers/
customers/consumer and does hurt the producing country a bit. So
everybody loses.
Great way of shooting yourself *and* your partners in the feet!
N.B. Steel is just one example. The problem occurs for nearly all if
not all products which are slapped with a tariff.
And then we have the countermeasures from the affected countries,
which will and do strike back. Example: Making Harley Davidson moving
part of its manufacturing *out* of the US.
Moral: In trade-wars everybody loses.
You must have missed it when Trump proclaimed that "Trade wars are good,
and easy to win!"
<https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/02/trump-trade-wars-are-good-and-easy-to-win.html>

;-)
--
Char Jackson
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-20 17:34:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Char Jackson
You must have missed it when Trump proclaimed that "Trade wars are good,
and easy to win!"
The grand absurdity of Trump's bullying approach with regard to trade
is; his administration didn't even try diplomacy.

Instead, Trump is acting as if this is 1946 and the USA is the only
intact economy on the planet. Trump doesn't understand that the
leaders and citizens of other nations will not tolerate being
humiliated by the United States, even if that means they endure a
degree of economic suffering.

If there are legitimate behavioral issues with trading partners, you
dispatch your state department to listen, talk and negotiate. Our
allies and the world at large will not tolerate the crazed moron
approach to international trade. If we do not remove Trump in a
reasonable period of time, it is the USA which will suffer the most in
this situation.

Consumers are already suffering in this country as Cadet Bonespur's
tariffs are simply a tax upon American citizens.
--
"Mr. Trump’s claims of no collusion are, in a word, hogwash,"

-John Brennan Director CIA ret. (August 2018)
Char Jackson
2018-08-20 15:51:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 20:55:36 -0400
Post by Wolf K
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 12:33:53 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]
I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade
deficit is bad?
I'm not an economist, so I will have to go along with the president
on this.
Donald Trump isn't an economist either, so why woluld you go along
with him on this?
Because the president thinks he has a solution to the problem of
manufacturing jobs being lost to China and Mexico. Hopefully the
tariffs will cause American companies to stop moving production
overseas, and produce their products here.
Or, like in the case of Harley Davidson, the tariffs caused the company
to close a US-based assembly plant and open a new assembly plant
overseas in order to avoid tariffs. Oops.

Remember when Trump said that trade wars are easy to win? Every news
outlet except Fox blasted him for saying that. Fox supported him, as
they do. As it turns out, everyone except Fox was right, and it didn't
have to be that way. It's not as if no one saw it coming. Almost
everyone saw it coming, Fox viewers excepted.

Or how about the Carrier corporation? Massive government handout to get
them to keep jobs in the US, which they happily accepted, then they
quickly moved most of the jobs to Mexico.

The big problem is that Trump doesn't read. He's shown no interest in
history, politics, economics, ethics, and of course immigration. His
knee jerk reaction to what he heard on Fox (that the US is being
"infested" with illegal aliens), was that a wall will keep them out. All
I ask is that you do what he hasn't: think about it for 5 seconds and
I'm sure you'll see that a wall won't help. Would *you* be able to get
over, under, or around a wall? Yeah, so can everyone else. This isn't
Germany or China. How well are their walls working?

The Republican Congress is complicit, as well. Before the Russians
installed him as President, many of them laughed at him and his stupid
ideas, but once he took office they held their noses and decided he was
dumb enough that he was someone they could manipulate to advance their
1950's-style agenda. You know, back when the country was great. *Cough*
When Obama was President, every dollar of spending had to be offset by a
dollar of savings somewhere else, but with Trump, you want a $Trillion
dollar tax bill? Sure, why not? You want to give 83% of its benefits to
the top 1%? Sure, why not?

In the end, we get the government we deserve. People are too busy to pay
attention, or they somehow fell into the cesspool that is Fox News, and
they go along with this loon with the orange face and hair. He'll be
gone from office one day, but the damage he's doing to the country and
to the planet will be with us for a very long time.
--
Char Jackson
Johnny
2018-08-20 16:21:37 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 10:51:36 -0500
Post by Char Jackson
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 20:55:36 -0400
Post by Wolf K
Post by Johnny
On Sun, 19 Aug 2018 12:33:53 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]
I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade
deficit is bad?
I'm not an economist, so I will have to go along with the
president on this.
Donald Trump isn't an economist either, so why woluld you go along
with him on this?
Because the president thinks he has a solution to the problem of
manufacturing jobs being lost to China and Mexico. Hopefully the
tariffs will cause American companies to stop moving production
overseas, and produce their products here.
Or, like in the case of Harley Davidson, the tariffs caused the
company to close a US-based assembly plant and open a new assembly
plant overseas in order to avoid tariffs. Oops.
Remember when Trump said that trade wars are easy to win? Every news
outlet except Fox blasted him for saying that. Fox supported him, as
they do. As it turns out, everyone except Fox was right, and it didn't
have to be that way. It's not as if no one saw it coming. Almost
everyone saw it coming, Fox viewers excepted.
Or how about the Carrier corporation? Massive government handout to
get them to keep jobs in the US, which they happily accepted, then
they quickly moved most of the jobs to Mexico.
The big problem is that Trump doesn't read. He's shown no interest in
history, politics, economics, ethics, and of course immigration. His
knee jerk reaction to what he heard on Fox (that the US is being
"infested" with illegal aliens), was that a wall will keep them out.
All I ask is that you do what he hasn't: think about it for 5 seconds
and I'm sure you'll see that a wall won't help. Would *you* be able
to get over, under, or around a wall? Yeah, so can everyone else.
This isn't Germany or China. How well are their walls working?
The Republican Congress is complicit, as well. Before the Russians
installed him as President, many of them laughed at him and his stupid
ideas, but once he took office they held their noses and decided he
was dumb enough that he was someone they could manipulate to advance
their 1950's-style agenda. You know, back when the country was great.
*Cough* When Obama was President, every dollar of spending had to be
offset by a dollar of savings somewhere else, but with Trump, you
want a $Trillion dollar tax bill? Sure, why not? You want to give 83%
of its benefits to the top 1%? Sure, why not?
In the end, we get the government we deserve. People are too busy to
pay attention, or they somehow fell into the cesspool that is Fox
News, and they go along with this loon with the orange face and hair.
He'll be gone from office one day, but the damage he's doing to the
country and to the planet will be with us for a very long time.
The Steel Workers Union is glad to see the tariffs, and most members
are Democrats.

Some people are going to be hurt by the tariffs, and some people are
going back to work because of the tariffs.

We have been losing manufacturing jobs for years to China and Mexico.
We can continue down that same road using slave labor, or we can do
something about it.

Bill Clinton signed NAFTA into law and the Democrats actually elected
him for a second term. Obama was going to get us into another free
trade agreement, and I'm sure if Hillary won, the TPP would have been
signed by now. That's one reason Trump won. The other was border
security. The Democrats failed to secure the border and had no
intentions to trying.

The Russians had nothing to with Trump getting elected, the people in
this country were sick of the way the Democrats were running it.
Char Jackson
2018-08-20 17:16:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
The Russians had nothing to with Trump getting elected, the people in
this country were sick of the way the Democrats were running it.
Putin disagrees with you. When asked by a reporter, "Did you want Trump
to win? Did you do anything to help him win?", his translated response
was, "Yes, I did. Yes, I did."

Interestingly, that exchange, which was on live TV with many news
organizations covering it, was edited out of the official White House
transcript. I guess it hit a little too close to home.
--
Char Jackson
Ken Blake
2018-08-20 21:01:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Char Jackson
Post by Johnny
The Russians had nothing to with Trump getting elected, the people in
this country were sick of the way the Democrats were running it.
Putin disagrees with you. When asked by a reporter, "Did you want Trump
to win? Did you do anything to help him win?", his translated response
was, "Yes, I did. Yes, I did."
Interestingly, that exchange, which was on live TV with many news
organizations covering it, was edited out of the official White House
transcript. I guess it hit a little too close to home.
This thread is *way* off-topic. Although I don't have a problem with
an occasional off-topic post (and I'm as guilty of that as anyone else
here), a whole off-topic thread that goes on and on, with umpteen
posts, shouldn't continue. So please, can we end this thread *now*
(even though I agree with the views of most of you)?
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-20 21:44:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ken Blake
Post by Char Jackson
Post by Johnny
The Russians had nothing to with Trump getting elected, the people in
this country were sick of the way the Democrats were running it.
Putin disagrees with you. When asked by a reporter, "Did you want Trump
to win? Did you do anything to help him win?", his translated response
was, "Yes, I did. Yes, I did."
Interestingly, that exchange, which was on live TV with many news
organizations covering it, was edited out of the official White House
transcript. I guess it hit a little too close to home.
This thread is *way* off-topic. Although I don't have a problem with
an occasional off-topic post (and I'm as guilty of that as anyone else
here), a whole off-topic thread that goes on and on, with umpteen
posts, shouldn't continue. So please, can we end this thread *now*
(even though I agree with the views of most of you)?
Ridiculous, the topic is FAR more important than your Usenet
sensibilities. Why don't you just ignore the topic? There is nothing
in the world more important then what is happening with regard to
Trump.
--
"Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities. Through
your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children,
humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a
nation."

- Admiral William H. McRaven (To Donald Trump, 2018)
Johnny
2018-08-20 21:57:16 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 14:01:28 -0700
Post by Ken Blake
Post by Char Jackson
Post by Johnny
The Russians had nothing to with Trump getting elected, the people
in this country were sick of the way the Democrats were running
it.
Putin disagrees with you. When asked by a reporter, "Did you want
Trump to win? Did you do anything to help him win?", his translated
response was, "Yes, I did. Yes, I did."
Interestingly, that exchange, which was on live TV with many news
organizations covering it, was edited out of the official White House
transcript. I guess it hit a little too close to home.
This thread is *way* off-topic. Although I don't have a problem with
an occasional off-topic post (and I'm as guilty of that as anyone else
here), a whole off-topic thread that goes on and on, with umpteen
posts, shouldn't continue. So please, can we end this thread *now*
(even though I agree with the views of most of you)?
I'm finished with this subject. alt.politics would be a good place to
discuss it.
Frank Slootweg
2018-08-21 12:43:29 UTC
Permalink
Ken Blake <***@invalid.news.com> wrote:
[...]
Post by Ken Blake
This thread is *way* off-topic. Although I don't have a problem with
an occasional off-topic post (and I'm as guilty of that as anyone else
here), a whole off-topic thread that goes on and on, with umpteen
posts, shouldn't continue. So please, can we end this thread *now*
(even though I agree with the views of most of you)?
If I don't want to see new postings in a thread, I just killfile the
thread. Problem solved.

Can't Forte Agent killfile a thread (on Subject or MID)?

Shadow
2018-08-20 18:12:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 10:51:36 -0500
Post by Char Jackson
Post by Johnny
Because the president thinks he has a solution to the problem of
manufacturing jobs being lost to China and Mexico. Hopefully the
tariffs will cause American companies to stop moving production
overseas, and produce their products here.
Or, like in the case of Harley Davidson, the tariffs caused the
company to close a US-based assembly plant and open a new assembly
plant overseas in order to avoid tariffs. Oops.
Remember when Trump said that trade wars are easy to win? Every news
outlet except Fox blasted him for saying that. Fox supported him, as
they do. As it turns out, everyone except Fox was right, and it didn't
have to be that way. It's not as if no one saw it coming. Almost
everyone saw it coming, Fox viewers excepted.
Or how about the Carrier corporation? Massive government handout to
get them to keep jobs in the US, which they happily accepted, then
they quickly moved most of the jobs to Mexico.
The big problem is that Trump doesn't read. He's shown no interest in
history, politics, economics, ethics, and of course immigration. His
knee jerk reaction to what he heard on Fox (that the US is being
"infested" with illegal aliens), was that a wall will keep them out.
All I ask is that you do what he hasn't: think about it for 5 seconds
and I'm sure you'll see that a wall won't help. Would *you* be able
to get over, under, or around a wall? Yeah, so can everyone else.
This isn't Germany or China. How well are their walls working?
The Republican Congress is complicit, as well. Before the Russians
installed him as President, many of them laughed at him and his stupid
ideas, but once he took office they held their noses and decided he
was dumb enough that he was someone they could manipulate to advance
their 1950's-style agenda. You know, back when the country was great.
*Cough* When Obama was President, every dollar of spending had to be
offset by a dollar of savings somewhere else, but with Trump, you
want a $Trillion dollar tax bill? Sure, why not? You want to give 83%
of its benefits to the top 1%? Sure, why not?
In the end, we get the government we deserve. People are too busy to
pay attention, or they somehow fell into the cesspool that is Fox
News, and they go along with this loon with the orange face and hair.
He'll be gone from office one day, but the damage he's doing to the
country and to the planet will be with us for a very long time.
The Steel Workers Union is glad to see the tariffs, and most members
are Democrats.
Yes, because they represent the workers at the factories that
are benefited directly by the tariffs. That's very few factories.
Post by Johnny
Some people are going to be hurt by the tariffs, and some people are
going back to work because of the tariffs.
MOST people are going to be hurt by the tariffs, because
everything will become more expensive. That means salaries will be
worth much less because they buy less.
The only winners are the minimum-wage Americans that are going
to be hired, and the CEOs of the companies that were benefited, they
will be able to charge whatever they want. There will be no outside
competition.They'll make millions.
Of course the people that had prior knowledge of what Trump
was going to do made millions selling stock of companies that would
lose because of the tariffs, and buying stock that would benefit.
That's a crime in most countries. It's called insider trading.
Something Trump's family specializes in....
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
Wolf K
2018-08-20 19:19:37 UTC
Permalink
On 2018-08-20 12:21, Johnny wrote:
[...]
Post by Johnny
We have been losing manufacturing jobs for years to China and Mexico.
We can continue down that same road using slave labor, or we can do
something about it.
[...]

Some kinds of manufacturing, yes.

The main stealer of manufacturing jobs is automation, which these days
means robots, which for example means not only cheaper cars but better
ones. Another major factor has been changing markets. Check out annual
US car sales:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/199974/us-car-sales-since-1951/.
You'll note that the peak years for car sales were the 1970s and 80s,
but that annual sales are about 1 to 2 million less now than they were
back then. In the meantime, the population has increased, so one would
expect car sales to increase, too. But they haven't. So of course have
laid off workers. They've also reduced the number of dealers, which was
painful for a lot of family-run businesses in the smaller towns.

Anecdote/Data point: Back in the early 1970s I saw brief documentary
about the new Pinto factory. One scene sticks in my mind: A number of
bits an pieces of shaped metal came into view, a worker aligned one here
and there, then a kind of cage descended over them, sparks scattered,
made a lovely impressive show, the cage lifted, and those pieces of
metal were the body of the Pinto, minus doors and windows. Something
like 600 weld made in about 30 seconds. On older assembly lines, those
welds were made one at a time by individual workers, who maneuvered a
welding head into position and moved it along the seams. To speed up
this stage, several people worked side-by-side. Took a lot longer. Also
required more skill. The robot did it faster, and more reliably, with
nearly zero variation between welds and bodies.
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
Do you know what they call alternative medicine that’s been proven to
work? Medicine. (T. Minchin)
Johnny
2018-08-20 20:38:10 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 15:19:37 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
We have been losing manufacturing jobs for years to China and
Mexico. We can continue down that same road using slave labor, or
we can do something about it.
[...]
Some kinds of manufacturing, yes.
It's strange how the number of jobs lost varies depending where you get
the information.

From CNN

Manufacturing jobs in the U.S. actually increased in the years after
the North America Free Trade Agreement with Mexico and Canada went into
effect in 1994.

https://money.cnn.com/2016/03/29/news/economy/us-manufacturing-jobs/index.html


NAFTA at 20: One Million U.S. Jobs Lost, Higher Income Inequality

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/lori-wallach/nafta-at-20-one-million-u_b_4550207.html
Post by Wolf K
The main stealer of manufacturing jobs is automation, which these
days means robots, which for example means not only cheaper cars but
better ones. Another major factor has been changing markets. Check
https://www.statista.com/statistics/199974/us-car-sales-since-1951/.
You'll note that the peak years for car sales were the 1970s and 80s,
but that annual sales are about 1 to 2 million less now than they
were back then. In the meantime, the population has increased, so one
would expect car sales to increase, too. But they haven't. So of
course have laid off workers. They've also reduced the number of
dealers, which was painful for a lot of family-run businesses in the
smaller towns.
Anecdote/Data point: Back in the early 1970s I saw brief documentary
about the new Pinto factory. One scene sticks in my mind: A number of
bits an pieces of shaped metal came into view, a worker aligned one
here and there, then a kind of cage descended over them, sparks
scattered, made a lovely impressive show, the cage lifted, and those
pieces of metal were the body of the Pinto, minus doors and windows.
Something like 600 weld made in about 30 seconds. On older assembly
lines, those welds were made one at a time by individual workers, who
maneuvered a welding head into position and moved it along the seams.
To speed up this stage, several people worked side-by-side. Took a
lot longer. Also required more skill. The robot did it faster, and
more reliably, with nearly zero variation between welds and bodies.
Wolf K
2018-08-20 23:37:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Mon, 20 Aug 2018 15:19:37 -0400
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
We have been losing manufacturing jobs for years to China and
Mexico. We can continue down that same road using slave labor, or
we can do something about it.
[...]
Some kinds of manufacturing, yes.
It's strange how the number of jobs lost varies depending where you get
the information.
Not strange at all, they count different objects.
Post by Johnny
From CNN
Manufacturing jobs in the U.S. actually increased in the years after
the North America Free Trade Agreement with Mexico and Canada went into
effect in 1994.
https://money.cnn.com/2016/03/29/news/economy/us-manufacturing-jobs/index.html
Net gains and losses hide gains and losses by industry by industry.
Post by Johnny
NAFTA at 20: One Million U.S. Jobs Lost, Higher Income Inequality
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/lori-wallach/nafta-at-20-one-million-u_b_4550207.html
Doesn't surprise me. But that's not the same as an increase in the
number of people without jobs. IOW, are there 1,000,000 fewer people
working now than 20 years ago? I don't think so. On the other hand, it's
more than plausible than 1,000,000 jobs disappeared. That's not the same
as job loss. To give a very mundane example: How many jobs were "lost"
when gas stations went to self-service?

There are two numbers that give a reasonably good overall picture of the
employment/unemployment situation:

a) the employment rate, that is, the percentage of working age people
who have jobs; and
b) the unemployment rate, that is the perecantage of people known to be
looking for jobs.
These two numbers do not add up 100% because a lot of people of working
age are not in the job market.

Over the last 70 years, the average employment rate has been around 60%.
So as the population increases, the number of people who have jobs also
increases. This is so even though millions of jobs were "lost" over the
same time period.

The better question isn't How many jobs were lost, but two questions
which are harder to answer: Which jobs were lost? And which jobs were
created? That kind of fine-grained data is hard to come by. In general,
people with high school education or less used to have good-paying jobs
up to about the early 1970s. Then those jobs began to disappear. I first
realsied what was happening whne I noticed that want ads for bank jobs
began to ask for a grade 12 diploma, instead of a grade 10
school-leaving certificate. A decade or two later admission to police
academy (in Ontario) required a college degree. And so it's gone over my
lifetime. What were once entry-level jobs are now summer jobs for
teenagers, and income-supplement jobs for retired folk. (I've paid
attention to these things because I was a teacher, and my students'
job-prospects mattered to me).

And the fact that the type of job that used to pay well either no longer
exists or doesn't pay as well as it used means a lot of hardship for a
lot of people. But getting rid of NAFTA or imposing tariffs won't bring
those jobs back.

If you think I'm drifting off topic, well, the more you try to
understand the job market, the more complicated it gets. That's life. :-)

PS1: From a business-oriented webite:
"Employment Rate in the United States increased to 60.50 percent in July
from 60.40 percent in June of 2018. Employment Rate in the United States
averaged 59.33 percent from 1950 until 2018, reaching an all time high
of 64.70 percent in April of 2000 and a record low of 55 percent in July
of 1954." [https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/employment-rate]

PS2: the fact that Clinton signed of on NAFTA doesn't mean it was
Democrat plot. The Republicans were just as much in favour, because
NAFTA gave corporations more rights than governments. Eg. if you pass a
local-source only law for tax-funded projects in your city or State,
then outside or foreign corporations that bid lower can sue for
compensation for "lost profits". And most of the time, they will win.

Have a good day,
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
Do you know what they call alternative medicine that’s been proven to
work? Medicine. (T. Minchin)
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-19 18:34:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wolf K
[...]
Post by Johnny
Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
[...]
I don't understand your point of view. Why do you think a trade deficit
is bad?
"Johnny" doesn't have even a basic understanding of international
trade or economics, he only knows the Trump talking points and catch
phrases.
--
"Reluctantly I have concluded that President Trump is a serious threat to US
national security. He is refusing to protect vital US interests from active
Russian attacks. It is apparent that he is for some unknown reason under the
sway of Mr Putin."

-Barry R McCaffrey, Gen (ret) U.S.Army
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-19 18:32:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
As for the tariffs, we will just have to wait and see. That's one
reason I said to give the man a chance. I think it's important to stop
the government subsidized steel from China being sold to the United
States. Why should we continue to have a trade deficit with China,
Mexico, and Japan?
No, we do not have to "wait and see". We do not need to allow this
low grade moron destroy the economies of our allies and eventually the
world.
--
"Not only has the past year seen an American president borrow despotic language
to refer to the free press, but it seems he has in turn inspired dictators and
authoritarians with his own language. We are not in a 'fake news' era, as
Bashar Assad says. We are, rather, in an era in which the authoritarian impulse
is reasserting itself, to challenge free people and free societies, everywhere."

- Jeff Flake United States Senator (R) AZ
(protesting Trump's anti-American behaviors)
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-19 18:24:57 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 21:46:43 -0400, "Mayayana"
Post by Mayayana
There you go again. It's not a contest between Hillary
and Trump. You're not on one team against another.
You're an American. Trump is your president. Hillary's gone.
If you're going to make your case for Trump on the basis
of, "Hillary would have been worse" then that's not much
of a case.
Mentioning Clinton and Obama is simply a way for the Trumpers to
deflect and distract. Trump owns all of the bad and ugly, including
the $1+ trillion budget deficit and the child abuse being committed by
ICE, DHS and HHS.

I never thought I would see the day when the POTUS intentionally
orphans children and does so as retribution for brown people seeking
asylum. It is more than a disgrace, it is absolutely criminal.
--
The problem is Donald Trump. The solution is impeachment or, the otherwise legal
removal, from office, of the greatest threat to peace the world has ever known.
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-19 18:17:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Johnny
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 18:41:03 -0400
Post by Mayayana
| I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
| Hillary had won...
Hasn't he had a chance? I think Hillary is a dishonest
opportunist and a fake Democrat. You can't be liberal
and still be funded by Wall St. I'm also not very political.
But I still see disaster and denial in Trump. He's been
appointing people to break gov't. He helped push a
big tax break for the rich. Basically, he got the key to the
store and he's grabbing what he can for himself and his
friends. His vision doesn't extend beyond that. I see
nothing more than a thug. I haven't seen any evidence
to the contrary.
One of the first things he did was get the U.S out of the Trans-Pacific
Partnership. and he is renegotiating NAFTA. Those are big
accomplishments, and help the American workers. With Hillary, NAFTA
would remain the same, and we would be a member of the TPP, which would
benefit the rich.
Absurd, pulling out of TPP hampers the USA and creates a giant vacuum
which will be filled by China. You apparently have no understanding
of international trade, TPP or NAFTA.
--
"Mr. Trump’s claims of no collusion are, in a word, hogwash,"

-John Brennan Director CIA ret. (August 2018)
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-19 18:14:17 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 18 Aug 2018 18:41:03 -0400, "Mayayana"
Post by Mayayana
| I can't understand why people don't just give the man a chance. If
| Hillary had won...
Hasn't he had a chance? I think Hillary is a dishonest
opportunist and a fake Democrat. You can't be liberal
and still be funded by Wall St. I'm also not very political.
But I still see disaster and denial in Trump. He's been
appointing people to break gov't. He helped push a
big tax break for the rich. Basically, he got the key to the
store and he's grabbing what he can for himself and his
friends. His vision doesn't extend beyond that. I see
nothing more than a thug. I haven't seen any evidence
to the contrary.
If you're rich, a plutocrat, don't believe global
warming is a problem, and don't think the FDA or other
citizen protections are relevant, and you also don't
think you owe it to your fellow citizens to help the poor
or disabled, then Trump is the obvious choice. For
anyone else, not so much.
The sad thing is that most Trump supporters
are not rich and never will be. They just hope beyond
hope that Trump will help them get their foot in the
door of wealth. Fat chance of that. You can't cut taxes
for the rich and still expect the working class and
middle class to do better. It just doesn't add up.
Whether or not Hillary would have been good has
nothing to do with it. It's a country and a society,
not a sporting event.
+1, well stated.
--
"Mr. Trump’s claims of no collusion are, in a word, hogwash,"

-John Brennan Director CIA ret. (August 2018)
Shadow
2018-08-18 20:16:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the biased
news stations.
Hilarious !!! Can I have it as a tagline ?
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
Weatherman
2018-08-19 08:30:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Post by Tim Slattery
Post by KenW
Post by Fokke Nauta
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
You ain't from this country so shut the F up
Lots of us in this country (USA) feel the same way.
Well I sure don't. My stocks/bonds are doing great, he is trying to
stop ILLEGAL immigration, building up the military and in general
trying to undo what the democrats have do to F**k up the country.
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the biased
news stations. Bet there is a load of news you have never heard about
and not only from FOX news. Obama did more harm to this country than
you will ever know because the Liberal news hides it. I hope to GOD
the Reps stay in power because Pelosi and Schumer will f**k everything
up or wait and see what happens if they win. One last thing "why does
the news & DEMONcrats' refuse to call it ILLEGAL IMMAGRATION..THINK
ABOUT
KenW
The above is a brainwashed TRumper. Sad.
KenW
2018-08-18 17:33:29 UTC
Permalink
By the way come to Colorado, I call it little Mexico and my cousin in
California feels the same way. I go to buy food and everything is in
Spanish they also teach English as a SECOND language in some schools.
this is the USA not another state in Mexico. I do have some great
Spanish friends.


KenW
Wolf K
2018-08-19 00:05:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
By the way come to Colorado, I call it little Mexico and my cousin in
California feels the same way. I go to buy food and everything is in
Spanish they also teach English as a SECOND language in some schools.
this is the USA not another state in Mexico. I do have some great
Spanish friends.
KenW
The USA is one of the few countries in the world without and official
language. Here in Canada we have two. We may end up a few more, as some
First Nations people think their languages should be official ones, too.
After all, they were here first....
--
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
Do you know what they call alternative medicine that’s been proven to
work? Medicine. (T. Minchin)
KenW
2018-08-19 00:39:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wolf K
The USA is one of the few countries in the world without and official
language. Here in Canada we have two. We may end up a few more, as some
First Nations people think their languages should be official ones, too.
After all, they were here first....
Canada is getting it's share of illegal immigrants although I don't
think, to the extent the US is. It just gets me going when people vote
for one party without even looking for a better person. Hell, I voted
for a Democratic governor in New Jersey that turned out to be gay
(which was known, not to me) know what, he did a great job. The
biggest reason I voted for Trump, was this country needed a big change
and he was not a politician. He is doing a great job , but the main
news outlets will never let that on. People listen to the Hollywood
types who are so full of crap.

I should not care, but this VET does
Paul
2018-08-19 02:27:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Post by Wolf K
The USA is one of the few countries in the world without and official
language. Here in Canada we have two. We may end up a few more, as some
First Nations people think their languages should be official ones, too.
After all, they were here first....
Canada is getting it's share of illegal immigrants although I don't
think, to the extent the US is. It just gets me going when people vote
for one party without even looking for a better person. Hell, I voted
for a Democratic governor in New Jersey that turned out to be gay
(which was known, not to me) know what, he did a great job. The
biggest reason I voted for Trump, was this country needed a big change
and he was not a politician. He is doing a great job , but the main
news outlets will never let that on. People listen to the Hollywood
types who are so full of crap.
I should not care, but this VET does
But they're not really illegal immigrants.

There's a distinction.

They're asylum seekers. They are processed based
on the notion they'll be killed or harassed if
they return to their own country. In the case
of some countries, these would be gay people.

Because of a certain treaty between the USA and
Canada, they cannot cross at an "official" crossing.
If they enter the country and apply for asylum,
the treaty conditions would apply.

Instead, they present themselves at an "unofficial"
crossing. An official greets them, and they're handcuffed
and sent off for processing (starts with background check,
many having sketchy paperwork).

Canada is thinking of tearing up the treaty they signed,
because the system is not working. But that's another
matter.

Some asylum seekers have been desperate enough,
to cross the border at the "wrong" spot in the
dead of winter (somewhere in Manitoba?). And
lose all their fingers and toes to frostbite.
Which means some of them are getting bad advice
on where to cross.

At the crossing in Quebec, you can take a taxi cab
to the crossing point (on the US side), walk up to the
border (a paved street in the middle of no-where),
present yourself, make your claim for asylum
and you're off for processing. We keep a couple
people on our side to handle them.

You could enter our country on a visa and
overstay your welcome. And that would be
illegal immigration. That's not where the
lineup is coming from.

"Since the beginning of January 2017 and up until
the end of March 2018, the RCMP have intercepted
25,645 people crossing the border into Canada illegally.

Public Safety Canada estimates another 2,500 came
across in April for a total at just over 28,000.

Once an application for asylum has been received by
the federal government, it takes about 19 months
for the initial assessment and another 10 months
for a final decision to be issued. A backlog of
cases and a shortage of staff to process the
applications have contributed to the wait times."

"A spokesperson for Public Safety Canada said the
243 removals that have taken place since April 2017
(the department did not separately track removals
from irregular migrants from January to March 2017)
may have been expedited for a number of reasons.

When someone crosses the border into Canada they are
first subject to a security and identity check. People
who have criminal convictions for serious crimes or
who have applied for refugee status in the past and
failed would not be eligible to apply again."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/asylum-seekers-safe-third-country-agreement-quebec-nigeria-1.4641896

Safe Third Country Agreement <=== treaty

"Refugees who first arrive in the U.S., therefore, can't
then apply for asylum in Canada at official border crossings.

That encourages illegal crossings from the U.S.,
immigration lawyers say. Such crossings have increased
dramatically in recent months, especially in Manitoba <=== freeze ass off
and Quebec."

"More than 200 law professors signed an open letter
last year calling on Ottawa to withdraw from the pact."

So that's the situation right now.

Meanwhile, we have to train a bunch more civil servants
to process them. A couple of major cities have made claims
for funding to house them and support them. Not big bucks,
but still, one level of government has to admit there is
a problem, by funding it.

*******

And we still haven't finished our Syrian project.

"As of early December, the Immigration Department said it
was still processing applications for 20,000 sponsored
Syrian refugees, including 15,927 from private sponsorship
groups, 4,006 under government assistance, and the rest
through joint sponsorships between the two."

These are basically asylum too, the difference being,
that various private groups are providing funding for
when they arrive. Some of these people are self-starters,
and have already made a business for themselves. But there
will inevitably be people who cannot achieve that
kind of new start here.

These are reasons our system is jamming up. As if it
needed an excuse. The processing time for regular
immigration is... forever. A dude at work was looking
at over five years to complete some kind of process
with the government. And that was years before any of
this started. If any interaction requires support from
the originating country, that can add nine months
instantly to the schedule. You could fly to Mars and
back, before the paperwork is done.

Paul
Shadow
2018-08-19 11:11:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
<something about the trickle-down theory, failing to
mention the guys upstairs have a bad case of diarrhea,
so guess who gets the shit>
I should not care, but this VET does
Work in the medical field ? So do I, only I didn't flunk my
exams and I became a people's doctor.
But I suppose animals need doctors too, so ... gratz.
I suppose it compensates, in part, for voting for Trump.
[]'s

--
You should try to watch the FOX news channel instead of all the biased
news stations. - Hilarious !!! 2018
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
Fokke Nauta
2018-08-20 11:16:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Post by Fokke Nauta
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
You ain't from this country so shut the F up
Posts from KenW will be deleted as from now on.

Fokke
Fokke Nauta
2018-08-20 11:17:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by KenW
Post by Fokke Nauta
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Trump is a loser anyway.
You ain't from this country so shut the F up
Posts from KenW will be deleted as from now on.

Fokke
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-18 22:12:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
An outstanding video! Thanks for posting it!
--
"Mr. Trump’s claims of no collusion are, in a word, hogwash,"

-John Brennan Director CIA ret. (August 2018)
Weatherman
2018-08-19 08:33:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Damn, I didn't mean to start a long thread. I didn't even mean to post
this here. However, fuck Trump and fuck anyone who voted for him.
KenW
2018-08-19 12:46:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Weatherman
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Damn, I didn't mean to start a long thread. I didn't even mean to post
this here. However, fuck Trump and fuck anyone who voted for him.
Of course Fuck You
Mayayana
2018-08-19 13:11:44 UTC
Permalink
"KenW" <***@invalid.net> wrote

| >Damn, I didn't mean to start a long thread. I didn't even mean to post
| >this here. However, fuck Trump and fuck anyone who voted for him.

| Of course Fuck You

An impressively, genteel, highbrow and informative
debate. Thank you, gentlemen. I feel I'm much better
informed about the issues now. :)
Stormin' Norman
2018-08-19 18:10:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Weatherman
Post by Weatherman
https://www.facebook.com/NowThisPolitics/videos/871886473158343/
Spoiler alert: Trump Land loses.
Damn, I didn't mean to start a long thread. I didn't even mean to post
this here. However, fuck Trump and fuck anyone who voted for him.
Don't have regrets, there is nothing more important than the ongoing
catastrophe known as Trump. To ignore the most important issue
happening in the world, to not discuss this disaster, regardless of
time or place, would be an abomination.

Martin Luther King Jr. once said:

"the time is always right to do the right thing"

The right thing includes protesting evil, injustice and treason. Those
who object are most likely on the wrong side of the issue.
--
"Trying to think of a job Trump would
actually be qualified for and all I came
up with was a traffic cone."

-Andy Borowitz
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...