Discussion:
Unable to format 64 GB PNY flash drive that was used as a Mac OS installer, from a MacBook Pro, in 64-bit W7.
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Ant
2017-06-09 23:28:19 UTC
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Hello.

I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?

Thank you in advance. :)
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Paul
2017-06-10 00:10:54 UTC
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Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Surprise, huh ?

Yeah, support for USB drives isn't very good.

While "diskpart" has "clean all", I'm not sure you
can always use that either. It depends on whether the
drive appears in "list disk" or not.

Certainly Disk Management isn't going to allow you to do anything.

I use "dd", and for an MSDOS partitioned mess, just dd over the
MBR sector.

dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk3\Partition0 bs=512 count=1

For a GPT setup on the USB flash, I might be forced to remove even
more of it. Bare minimum, I might have to erase 128MB, to get
rid of the scent of GPT partitions. Some software isn't happy not
seeing the MBR, and can locate the remains of a GPT setup.

dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk3\Partition0 bs=1048576 count=128

I generally don't like to waste "wear life" on unnecessary erasures,
which is why I'm not attracted to "clean all" in command-line diskpart
utility.

*******

This is the dd I use, in Windows. Use in an administrator Command Prompt.

http://www.chrysocome.net/dd

http://www.chrysocome.net/downloads/dd-0.6beta3.zip

Paul
Ant
2017-06-10 00:20:11 UTC
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Post by Paul
Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Surprise, huh ?
Yeah. I thought my USB drive broke/died!
Post by Paul
Yeah, support for USB drives isn't very good.
In 64-bit W7? Newer Windows versions have no problems?
Post by Paul
While "diskpart" has "clean all", I'm not sure you
can always use that either. It depends on whether the
drive appears in "list disk" or not.
Certainly Disk Management isn't going to allow you to do anything.
That's dumb/stupid. :(
Post by Paul
I use "dd", and for an MSDOS partitioned mess, just dd over the
MBR sector.
dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk3\Partition0 bs=512 count=1
For a GPT setup on the USB flash, I might be forced to remove even
more of it. Bare minimum, I might have to erase 128MB, to get
rid of the scent of GPT partitions. Some software isn't happy not
seeing the MBR, and can locate the remains of a GPT setup.
dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk3\Partition0 bs=1048576 count=128
I generally don't like to waste "wear life" on unnecessary erasures,
which is why I'm not attracted to "clean all" in command-line diskpart
utility.
*******
This is the dd I use, in Windows. Use in an administrator Command Prompt.
http://www.chrysocome.net/dd
http://www.chrysocome.net/downloads/dd-0.6beta3.zip
Sheesh, might as well do it under Linux/Debian for DD. Ha. I am
surprised MS doesn't allow this big cleanup from other OSes. Very
annoying.
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T
2017-06-10 02:20:39 UTC
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Post by Ant
Post by Paul
Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Surprise, huh ?
Yeah. I thought my USB drive broke/died!
Post by Paul
Yeah, support for USB drives isn't very good.
In 64-bit W7? Newer Windows versions have no problems?
Post by Paul
While "diskpart" has "clean all", I'm not sure you
can always use that either. It depends on whether the
drive appears in "list disk" or not.
Certainly Disk Management isn't going to allow you to do anything.
That's dumb/stupid. :(
Post by Paul
I use "dd", and for an MSDOS partitioned mess, just dd over the
MBR sector.
dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk3\Partition0 bs=512 count=1
For a GPT setup on the USB flash, I might be forced to remove even
more of it. Bare minimum, I might have to erase 128MB, to get
rid of the scent of GPT partitions. Some software isn't happy not
seeing the MBR, and can locate the remains of a GPT setup.
dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk3\Partition0 bs=1048576 count=128
I generally don't like to waste "wear life" on unnecessary erasures,
which is why I'm not attracted to "clean all" in command-line diskpart
utility.
*******
This is the dd I use, in Windows. Use in an administrator Command Prompt.
http://www.chrysocome.net/dd
http://www.chrysocome.net/downloads/dd-0.6beta3.zip
Sheesh, might as well do it under Linux/Debian for DD. Ha. I am
surprised MS doesn't allow this big cleanup from other OSes. Very
annoying.
That is what I was going to say too. This happens to me all th e
time. I just boot into a Live DVD/USB, open terminal, elevate
to root, and dd the turkey.

USE THE FOLLOWING AT YOUR OWN RISK:

to find your drive, do not insert it,
ls -al /dev/sd*
then insert it again
ls -al /dev/sd*
the new drive is your flash drive

Then nuke the drive with dd
dd if=/dev/zero of=/sdx (the one you found without the 1,2,3)
VanguardLH
2017-06-10 03:03:10 UTC
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Post by Ant
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
"I could delete volumes, but not new volumes."

But not "what" on new volumes? Is "delete" carried from the first
phrase to the second to mean you could create new partitions on the USB
flash drive but then you were unable to delete those newly created
partitions?

Were any partitions on the flash drive listed as RAW in Windows' disk
manager (diskmgmt.msc)? Their tool doesn't handle those. A 3rd party
partition manager is needed, like Easeus Partition Manager or Minitool
Partition Wizard. Portable versions are available for each but Easeus
requires a payware version of their software to get their portable
version. Most, maybe all, 3rd-party partition managers are more capable
than Disk Management bundled in Windows.

Did you delete ALL partitions from the USB flash drive? Then did you
create one partition that spanned their entire USB flash drive? You
cannot format unless a partition is present. Formatting lays down a
file system within a volume/partition.

"flash drive" doesn't say if it is a USB device or a flash card. If a
flash card, I've seen those readers go bad. I thought it was likely due
to abuse (users shoving the cards in too hard, at an angle, or upside
down, and breaking the enclosure causing cracks that prevented good
contact) but I've seen too many that were good, lightly used, and still
went bad. If the card reader is built into the case, it's a bitch to
find a replacement. There are USB adapters: the adapter plugs into a
USB port and the flash card slides into the adapter. After all, the
card reader is a USB hub, anyway: it plugs into a USB port on the mobo.

<aside>
I just recently called PNY on a failed USB flash drive. I could no
longer write my huge backup files (>22 GB) to it. Reading files from
that drive was okay as transfer speed was as expected. Try to write a
file and the copy would hang at 50% to 99% and get stuck there for
hours. They agreed to cover it under warranty but shipping (my cost)
would be $10.21 via UPS (they didn't want me to use USPS). I can get a
new 64 GB USB flash drive for a wee bit over twice that cost (i.e., $11
more) so I decided to toss the dead PNY drive and get the new drive
(different brand). I'd spend the money on shipping the defective one
back and perhaps get back another that also died within a few months of
light use (few files but very large files) for the same cause. Did not
feel like getting burned twice. I'm not saying PNY makes bad products.
I have two 32 GB PNY USB flash drives that are still working okay but
they are regular devices (one housing, one plug), not the OTG
(on-the-go) type of USB drives with the standard and micro USB
connectors (which I got for use on my PC or smartphone) like the one
that failed. The PNY OTG drive was an adapter with 2 USB plugs and a
flash card that slid into it. From what I've read, seems the OTG drives
have a high fatality rate. Usually the micro USB plug side goes bad
(but I had not yet used that side).
</aside>
J. P. Gilliver (John)
2017-06-10 13:24:07 UTC
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Post by VanguardLH
Post by Ant
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
"I could delete volumes, but not new volumes."
But not "what" on new volumes?
I was a bit puzzled too, but I assumed he meant create.

Paul has as usual given an exhaustive reply (-:.

(Bad luck on your PNY one.)
[]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)***@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"Bother," said Pooh, as he tasted the bacon in his sandwich.
Ant
2017-06-11 00:50:14 UTC
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Post by J. P. Gilliver (John)
Post by VanguardLH
Post by Ant
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
"I could delete volumes, but not new volumes."
But not "what" on new volumes?
I was a bit puzzled too, but I assumed he meant create.
Paul has as usual given an exhaustive reply (-:.
(Bad luck on your PNY one.)
[]
Sorry about that. :)
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Quote of the Week: "Don't step on ants... they're people too." --a quote from ANTZ movie
Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
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Ant
2017-06-11 00:49:50 UTC
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Post by VanguardLH
Post by Ant
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
"I could delete volumes, but not new volumes."
But not "what" on new volumes? Is "delete" carried from the first
phrase to the second to mean you could create new partitions on the USB
flash drive but then you were unable to delete those newly created
partitions?
Oops. I was able to delete the existing two volumes, but could not do
anything with that one. Also, no formatting. :(
Post by VanguardLH
Were any partitions on the flash drive listed as RAW in Windows' disk
manager (diskmgmt.msc)? Their tool doesn't handle those. A 3rd party
partition manager is needed, like Easeus Partition Manager or Minitool
Partition Wizard. Portable versions are available for each but Easeus
requires a payware version of their software to get their portable
version. Most, maybe all, 3rd-party partition managers are more capable
than Disk Management bundled in Windows.
Did you delete ALL partitions from the USB flash drive? Then did you
create one partition that spanned their entire USB flash drive? You
cannot format unless a partition is present. Formatting lays down a
file system within a volume/partition.
I recall there were three unreadable partitions to W7. Far left and
right in its graph. I deleted those and wanted to format, but couldn't
(no option).
Post by VanguardLH
"flash drive" doesn't say if it is a USB device or a flash card. If a
flash card, I've seen those readers go bad. I thought it was likely due
It was a flash stick like this:
https://www.amazon.com/PNY-Turbo-Elite-Flash-Drive/dp/B01DWN1CMG
Post by VanguardLH
<aside>
I just recently called PNY on a failed USB flash drive. I could no
longer write my huge backup files (>22 GB) to it. Reading files from
that drive was okay as transfer speed was as expected. Try to write a
file and the copy would hang at 50% to 99% and get stuck there for
hours. They agreed to cover it under warranty but shipping (my cost)
would be $10.21 via UPS (they didn't want me to use USPS). I can get a
new 64 GB USB flash drive for a wee bit over twice that cost (i.e., $11
more) so I decided to toss the dead PNY drive and get the new drive
(different brand). I'd spend the money on shipping the defective one
back and perhaps get back another that also died within a few months of
light use (few files but very large files) for the same cause. Did not
feel like getting burned twice. I'm not saying PNY makes bad products.
I have two 32 GB PNY USB flash drives that are still working okay but
they are regular devices (one housing, one plug), not the OTG
(on-the-go) type of USB drives with the standard and micro USB
connectors (which I got for use on my PC or smartphone) like the one
that failed. The PNY OTG drive was an adapter with 2 USB plugs and a
flash card that slid into it. From what I've read, seems the OTG drives
have a high fatality rate. Usually the micro USB plug side goes bad
(but I had not yet used that side).
</aside>
That sucks. I have had older drives go bad too like SP, generic, etc.
What is crazier is my smaller and oldest ones still work like 64 MB, 128
MB, etc. Argh!
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Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
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Paul
2017-06-11 04:56:49 UTC
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Post by Ant
Post by VanguardLH
Post by Ant
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
"I could delete volumes, but not new volumes."
But not "what" on new volumes? Is "delete" carried from the first
phrase to the second to mean you could create new partitions on the USB
flash drive but then you were unable to delete those newly created
partitions?
Oops. I was able to delete the existing two volumes, but could not do
anything with that one. Also, no formatting. :(
Post by VanguardLH
Were any partitions on the flash drive listed as RAW in Windows' disk
manager (diskmgmt.msc)? Their tool doesn't handle those. A 3rd party
partition manager is needed, like Easeus Partition Manager or Minitool
Partition Wizard. Portable versions are available for each but Easeus
requires a payware version of their software to get their portable
version. Most, maybe all, 3rd-party partition managers are more capable
than Disk Management bundled in Windows.
Did you delete ALL partitions from the USB flash drive? Then did you
create one partition that spanned their entire USB flash drive? You
cannot format unless a partition is present. Formatting lays down a
file system within a volume/partition.
I recall there were three unreadable partitions to W7. Far left and
right in its graph. I deleted those and wanted to format, but couldn't
(no option).
Post by VanguardLH
"flash drive" doesn't say if it is a USB device or a flash card. If a
flash card, I've seen those readers go bad. I thought it was likely due
https://www.amazon.com/PNY-Turbo-Elite-Flash-Drive/dp/B01DWN1CMG
Post by VanguardLH
<aside>
I just recently called PNY on a failed USB flash drive. I could no
longer write my huge backup files (>22 GB) to it. Reading files from
that drive was okay as transfer speed was as expected. Try to write a
file and the copy would hang at 50% to 99% and get stuck there for
hours. They agreed to cover it under warranty but shipping (my cost)
would be $10.21 via UPS (they didn't want me to use USPS). I can get a
new 64 GB USB flash drive for a wee bit over twice that cost (i.e., $11
more) so I decided to toss the dead PNY drive and get the new drive
(different brand). I'd spend the money on shipping the defective one
back and perhaps get back another that also died within a few months of
light use (few files but very large files) for the same cause. Did not
feel like getting burned twice. I'm not saying PNY makes bad products.
I have two 32 GB PNY USB flash drives that are still working okay but
they are regular devices (one housing, one plug), not the OTG
(on-the-go) type of USB drives with the standard and micro USB
connectors (which I got for use on my PC or smartphone) like the one
that failed. The PNY OTG drive was an adapter with 2 USB plugs and a
flash card that slid into it. From what I've read, seems the OTG drives
have a high fatality rate. Usually the micro USB plug side goes bad
(but I had not yet used that side).
</aside>
That sucks. I have had older drives go bad too like SP, generic, etc.
What is crazier is my smaller and oldest ones still work like 64 MB, 128
MB, etc. Argh!
TLC flash doesn't hold up quite as well. I have a couple
dead ones here. I pulled them apart (it's just compression tabs
on the lid), read off the part number, and the big chip was TLC
on each one. I got about a year out of each one.

I have an SLC flash, 8GB, which is still going. Older, lower capacity
sticks can be SLC too. That's the good stuff. My 8GB one, actually
consists of two chips in a dual channel config. So the chips are 4GB
each.

Regarding the removal of partitions, remember that Windows only
supports one partition on a USB stick. Linux treats the stick like
a HDD and allows the usual four (primary) partitions for MSDOS partitioning.
If you take a Linux stick over to a Windows machine, only the
*first* partition can mount. Now, think carefully about the problem.
If you delete partitions one and three somehow, the second partition
can be in the second partition table slot. The Windows OS isn't going
to like an attempt to format it. Because it can't "see" partitions
out there. I don't know what the rules are for each "test case",
but it's a recipe for annoyance.

That's why I recommend removing all partitions, if you insist on
formatting on the Windows side.

Either you "keep Windows discipline" and use only one partition
on it. Or, if the stick moves between Linux and Windows, maybe
the first partition can be the "interchange" partition. While
the other partitions are only for Linux-ville.

The behavior of a drive, is also a function of the RMB bit.
More info on the care and feeding of Flash, can be found here.

http://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbstick_e.html

When you "dd" a hybrid Linux ISO9660 onto a USB stick, it
can be an awful mess to clean up later. You'll see around
three partitions. And the first partition, Gparted will tell
you that it's "declaring the wrong sector size", because the
ISO9660 uses 2048 byte sectors, while the USB stick supports
512 byte sectors. The older non-hybrid distro and USB-Creator-gtk,
do a much better job and are easier to clean up later (it's just
a single FAT32 partition in that case).

Paul
Ant
2017-06-12 00:35:25 UTC
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Post by Paul
TLC flash doesn't hold up quite as well. I have a couple
dead ones here. I pulled them apart (it's just compression tabs
on the lid), read off the part number, and the big chip was TLC
on each one. I got about a year out of each one.
I have an SLC flash, 8GB, which is still going. Older, lower capacity
sticks can be SLC too. That's the good stuff. My 8GB one, actually
consists of two chips in a dual channel config. So the chips are 4GB
each.
I just wished there was an easy to see which flash drives have the type
before buying.
Post by Paul
Regarding the removal of partitions, remember that Windows only
supports one partition on a USB stick. Linux treats the stick like
a HDD and allows the usual four (primary) partitions for MSDOS partitioning.
If you take a Linux stick over to a Windows machine, only the
*first* partition can mount. Now, think carefully about the problem.
If you delete partitions one and three somehow, the second partition
can be in the second partition table slot. The Windows OS isn't going
to like an attempt to format it. Because it can't "see" partitions
out there. I don't know what the rules are for each "test case",
but it's a recipe for annoyance.
That's why I recommend removing all partitions, if you insist on
formatting on the Windows side.
Either you "keep Windows discipline" and use only one partition
on it. Or, if the stick moves between Linux and Windows, maybe
the first partition can be the "interchange" partition. While
the other partitions are only for Linux-ville.
The behavior of a drive, is also a function of the RMB bit.
More info on the care and feeding of Flash, can be found here.
http://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbstick_e.html
When you "dd" a hybrid Linux ISO9660 onto a USB stick, it
can be an awful mess to clean up later. You'll see around
three partitions. And the first partition, Gparted will tell
you that it's "declaring the wrong sector size", because the
ISO9660 uses 2048 byte sectors, while the USB stick supports
512 byte sectors. The older non-hybrid distro and USB-Creator-gtk,
do a much better job and are easier to clean up later (it's just
a single FAT32 partition in that case).
So basically, Windows itself can't do it. I need a third party software
or Linux. :(
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Mosquitoes and bow-legged ants... I've come to tell you the story..."
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Paul
2017-06-12 01:26:46 UTC
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Post by Ant
So basically, Windows itself can't do it. I need a third party software
or Linux. :(
If Windows "diskpart" refuses to give access to the drive
so you can do a "clean" or "clean all", then there is still
the "dd.exe" port available for Windows, which allows cleanup.

I generally attempt to do the fewest write cycles to a drive,
if I can manage it. "Clean all" would re-write the whole
drive, which doesn't hurt a HDD all that much, but wastes
wear life on a Flash stick.

I do "clean all", all the time here, when I want a pristine
background for white space, just before doing a boot disk restore.
Doing that ensures that if TestDisk is used some day, it
doesn't spot any "phantom" partitions hiding in white-space.

Paul
Ken Springer
2017-06-17 18:50:39 UTC
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Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Hi, Ant,

Most likely, the flash drive has been reformatted to the Mac file
format, OS X Extended (Journaled). Windows isn't smart enough to
recognize Mac formats.

I think the

Stick the flash drive into your Mac.
Open Disk Utility. Usually, that is Applications>Utility
Select the flash drive in the left pane.
Select Erase
Under Format, select one of the Windows format options
Click on Erase.

Pretty sure Windows will now recognize the drive, although you may have
to use Disk Management to assign a drive letter. I've never had a
reason to try this, so there is no guarantee.
--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.11.6
Firefox 53.0.2 (64 bit)
Thunderbird 52.0
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
pjp
2017-06-18 00:57:33 UTC
Reply
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In article <oi3tm0$flb$***@news.albasani.net>, ***@greeleynet.com
says...
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Hi, Ant,
Most likely, the flash drive has been reformatted to the Mac file
format, OS X Extended (Journaled). Windows isn't smart enough to
recognize Mac formats.
I think the
Stick the flash drive into your Mac.
Open Disk Utility. Usually, that is Applications>Utility
Select the flash drive in the left pane.
Select Erase
Under Format, select one of the Windows format options
Click on Erase.
Pretty sure Windows will now recognize the drive, although you may have
to use Disk Management to assign a drive letter. I've never had a
reason to try this, so there is no guarantee.
I suspect if you use Disk Management to delete the Mac partition you can
then create a NTFS partition and things should be fine after that.

Apparently Ext32 can write/read by both OS's if you want/need to use it
in both.
Ant
2017-06-18 03:12:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by pjp
says...
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Hi, Ant,
Most likely, the flash drive has been reformatted to the Mac file
format, OS X Extended (Journaled). Windows isn't smart enough to
recognize Mac formats.
I think the
Stick the flash drive into your Mac.
Open Disk Utility. Usually, that is Applications>Utility
Select the flash drive in the left pane.
Select Erase
Under Format, select one of the Windows format options
Click on Erase.
Pretty sure Windows will now recognize the drive, although you may have
to use Disk Management to assign a drive letter. I've never had a
reason to try this, so there is no guarantee.
I suspect if you use Disk Management to delete the Mac partition you can
then create a NTFS partition and things should be fine after that.
Apparently Ext32 can write/read by both OS's if you want/need to use it
in both.
I tried to use 64-bit W7's Disk Management to remove all partitions, but couldn't do all. :(
--
Quote of the Week: "Ladies and gentlemen, hoboes and tramps... Crosseyed
Mosquitoes and bow-legged ants... I've come to tell you the story..."
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Mike S
2017-06-18 07:14:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Ant
Post by pjp
says...
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Hi, Ant,
Most likely, the flash drive has been reformatted to the Mac file
format, OS X Extended (Journaled). Windows isn't smart enough to
recognize Mac formats.
I think the
Stick the flash drive into your Mac.
Open Disk Utility. Usually, that is Applications>Utility
Select the flash drive in the left pane.
Select Erase
Under Format, select one of the Windows format options
Click on Erase.
Pretty sure Windows will now recognize the drive, although you may have
to use Disk Management to assign a drive letter. I've never had a
reason to try this, so there is no guarantee.
I suspect if you use Disk Management to delete the Mac partition you can
then create a NTFS partition and things should be fine after that.
Apparently Ext32 can write/read by both OS's if you want/need to use it
in both.
I tried to use 64-bit W7's Disk Management to remove all partitions, but couldn't do all. :(
Sounds like this might work

Can GParted handle it?

Manipulate file systems such as:
btrfs
ext2 / ext3 / ext4
fat16 / fat32
hfs / hfs+
linux-swap
lvm2 pv
nilfs2
ntfs
reiserfs / reiser4
ufs
xfs
Ant
2017-06-19 03:38:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Mike S
Post by Ant
Post by pjp
says...
Post by Ken Springer
Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Hi, Ant,
Most likely, the flash drive has been reformatted to the Mac file
format, OS X Extended (Journaled). Windows isn't smart enough to
recognize Mac formats.
I think the
Stick the flash drive into your Mac.
Open Disk Utility. Usually, that is Applications>Utility
Select the flash drive in the left pane.
Select Erase
Under Format, select one of the Windows format options
Click on Erase.
Pretty sure Windows will now recognize the drive, although you may have
to use Disk Management to assign a drive letter. I've never had a
reason to try this, so there is no guarantee.
I suspect if you use Disk Management to delete the Mac partition you can
then create a NTFS partition and things should be fine after that.
Apparently Ext32 can write/read by both OS's if you want/need to use it
in both.
I tried to use 64-bit W7's Disk Management to remove all partitions, but couldn't do all. :(
Sounds like this might work
Can GParted handle it?
Yes, I used gparted in my 64-bit Debian oldstable/Jessie to fix the
issue as show in my original post. :) It sucks Windows couldn't do it.
:P
--
Happy Father's Day including the male alates that died right after their nuptial flights.
Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.home.dhs.org (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
| |o o| |
\ _ / Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail privately. If credit-
( ) ing, then please kindly use Ant nickname and AQFL URL/link.
Paul
2017-06-18 08:33:40 UTC
Reply
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Raw Message
Post by Ant
Post by pjp
I suspect if you use Disk Management to delete the Mac partition you can
then create a NTFS partition and things should be fine after that.
Apparently Ext32 can write/read by both OS's if you want/need to use it
in both.
I tried to use 64-bit W7's Disk Management to remove all partitions, but couldn't do all. :(
FAT32 is read/write on Windows/Mac/Linux

NTFS is read/write on Windows/Linux, with Linux not having reparse points
supported in livecd-based mounts, and (maybe) FUSE mounts having some
support. This makes deleting some Win10 content on NTFS, a problem.
MacOSX support was read-only for the longest while, and I cannot tell
you what epoch full support might have been switched on. This could
be a patent/licensing issue of some sort, rather than a technical issue.
Linux has no problem messing up NTFS for users :-) (Journal state
invalidated, dirty bit set, cannot access hibernated OS partitions...)

EXFat support, not sure. WinXP is via separate package. Linux by FUSE
file system (not enabled by default necessarily on a LiveCD),
MacOSX only recently.

I generally "have no fear" with FAT32 or NTFS.

There are a couple IFS packages so you can mount Linux EXT partitions.
The Mac HFS/HFS+ usually has some tools for interworking, so it's
not a dead loss. Linux can copy files off Mac partitions.

UFS is the tough one (Unix File System). That might be
as used in FreeBSD.

*******

To fix USB flash sticks, you can try Diskpart (the command line equivalent
of Disk Management).

diskpart
list disk
select disk 0
clean <--- zeros the MBR
clean all <--- zeros every sector

A USB flash stick should not support Secure Erase. Secure Erase was
added to the ATA standard a number of years ago. It might not
exist in SCSI (and maybe SAS). But it should exist on SATA and IDE.
Secure Erase erases every sector, MBR and all. Enhanced Secure Erase
not only erases every sector, it (attempts) to erase all "spare" sectors
on the drive. Spare sectors that are not normally accessible via the IDE
interface. The Enhanced flavor is a kind of forensic erasure.

Diskpart cannot work, if the device refuses to show up as a
"row" in Disk Management. For a storage device which is
annoying you, run Disk Management first. The disk numbering
in Disk Management, is "similar" to DiskPart, but not necessarily
the same. Some of the interfaces in Windows are zero-origin, and
some are one-origin. Lots of things are "in the same order",
but watch the numbering carefully.

So if the objective here was to not use Linux, your
two options are

1) diskpart, clean or clean all, of a selected disk

2) dd.exe as a means to zero any sector your heart
could desire. With "seek" and "skip" you can rip
and tear anything you want, with byte precision.
For example, with dd.exe, you can replace the 446 bytes
of boot code in the MBR, without affecting the partition
table. As long as you have a second disk drive, with a sample
of those 446 bytes to use. Many other operations will be
done with sector-level accuracy (whatever the native
sector happens to be).

http://www.chrysocome.net/dd
http://www.chrysocome.net/downloads/dd-0.6beta3.zip

dd --list # administrator command prompt, use this command
# to get the "disk names"

dd if=/dev/zero of=\\?\Device\Harddisk3\Partition0 # Erase the fourth disk completely
# Needs more params, for speed reasons

I don't like to erase whole Flash devices, because it
wastes one wear cycle. But if you absolutely must get
on with your life, that's how you can do it.

Zeroing the MBR works for MSDOS partitioning.

Zeroing the MBR as well as the 128MB GPT partition table,
works for GPT. Zeroing the MBR *might* have worked, except
too many utilities "sniff" the remaining GPT and this defeat
your attempts to move on in life. The utilities "assume"
you want GPT forever after, if they "sniff" that table.

It can be trying at times, to work with USB flash sticks,
but with enough hammers, you'll eventually succeed.

Paul
Ant
2017-06-19 03:40:01 UTC
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Post by Paul
Post by Ant
Post by pjp
I suspect if you use Disk Management to delete the Mac partition you can
then create a NTFS partition and things should be fine after that.
Apparently Ext32 can write/read by both OS's if you want/need to use it
in both.
I tried to use 64-bit W7's Disk Management to remove all partitions, but couldn't do all. :(
FAT32 is read/write on Windows/Mac/Linux
NTFS is read/write on Windows/Linux, with Linux not having reparse points
supported in livecd-based mounts, and (maybe) FUSE mounts having some
support. This makes deleting some Win10 content on NTFS, a problem.
MacOSX support was read-only for the longest while, and I cannot tell
you what epoch full support might have been switched on. This could
be a patent/licensing issue of some sort, rather than a technical issue.
Linux has no problem messing up NTFS for users :-) (Journal state
invalidated, dirty bit set, cannot access hibernated OS partitions...)
EXFat support, not sure. WinXP is via separate package. Linux by FUSE
file system (not enabled by default necessarily on a LiveCD),
MacOSX only recently.
I generally "have no fear" with FAT32 or NTFS.
There are a couple IFS packages so you can mount Linux EXT partitions.
The Mac HFS/HFS+ usually has some tools for interworking, so it's
not a dead loss. Linux can copy files off Mac partitions.
UFS is the tough one (Unix File System). That might be
as used in FreeBSD.
*******
To fix USB flash sticks, you can try Diskpart (the command line equivalent
of Disk Management).
diskpart
list disk
select disk 0
clean <--- zeros the MBR
clean all <--- zeros every sector
Thanks. Is there no GUI version? :)
--
Happy Father's Day including the male alates that died right after their nuptial flights.
Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
/\___/\ Ant(Dude) @ http://antfarm.home.dhs.org (Personal Web Site)
/ /\ /\ \ Ant's Quality Foraged Links: http://aqfl.net
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\ _ / Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail privately. If credit-
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Paul
2017-06-19 05:55:56 UTC
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Post by Ant
Post by Paul
To fix USB flash sticks, you can try Diskpart (the command line equivalent
of Disk Management).
diskpart
list disk
select disk 0
clean <--- zeros the MBR
clean all <--- zeros every sector
Thanks. Is there no GUI version? :)
Disk Management doesn't have a GUI item for those.

And obviously, "clean all" is very dangerous. If you
put that in a menu, imagine the tech support calls
Microsoft Support would start getting.

Diskpart is really designed like a "command processor",
so you can feed it a "here is" script and it just
does it. That's possibly why it doesn't have any
confirmation question to answer before it cleans stuff.

Paul

Paul
2017-06-18 01:08:16 UTC
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Post by Ken Springer
Post by Ant
Hello.
I used my 64 GB PNY flash drive to make a bootable Mac OS (El
Capitan/Sierra as shown in https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372)
installer on MacBook Pros. Today, I decided to reuse this flash drive in
Windows. When I connected it to my old, updated 64-bit W7 HPE SP1 box, I
was unable to reformat it. I tried Computer's Disk Management, but still
wouldn't let me format. I could delete volumes, but not new volumes. I
had to use my Linux/Debian stable/Jessie box's gparted. What was the
correct way to reformat it in 64-bit W7?
Thank you in advance. :)
Hi, Ant,
Most likely, the flash drive has been reformatted to the Mac file
format, OS X Extended (Journaled). Windows isn't smart enough to
recognize Mac formats.
Windows needs $50 worth of help.

http://www.mediafour.com/software/macdrive/

"Works with Windows 10/8.1/8/7 and Server 2012 and 2016"

I don't know if it handles both HFS and HFS+,
resource and data fork, or macbinary.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacBinary

One reason Windows makes this easy, is because it has
the IFS interface (Installable File System). It allows
third-parties to add support for file systems to Windows.

The first one I tried, years ago, was EXT2IFS, which
mounts EXT partitions. The EXT was actually my dual boot
Linux slash partition, and I could load files into it,
before rebooting the computer and bringing up Linux.

Paul
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