Discussion:
New Mobo, Speaker problem
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(PeteCresswell)
2017-05-27 17:53:20 UTC
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New GigaByte Z87X mobo with RelTek HD audio Manager.

Have installed, then re-installed audio drivers from GigaByte.

- Set RealTek HD Audio Manager to "Speakers".

- Maximize volume

- Note that analog back panel highlights receptacle that amplified
speakers are plugged in to.

- Turn amplified speakers' amplifier up to max - giving a low-level of
white noise.

- Note that varying Windows' volume control has no effect on level
of white noise.

- Un-plug amplified speakers and note that white nose goes away.

- Plug amplified speakers into the same port on another PC, play some
music, and they work a-ok.

- Plug amplified speakers back into problem PC

- Open up Speakers | Sounds | Program Events

- Choose a sound.

- Click "Test", and the white noise stops for the duration of the sound,
but no sound comes out of speakers.

I'm doing something dumb.... but what?
--
Pete Cresswell
Paul
2017-05-27 18:44:47 UTC
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Post by (PeteCresswell)
New GigaByte Z87X mobo with RelTek HD audio Manager.
Have installed, then re-installed audio drivers from GigaByte.
- Set RealTek HD Audio Manager to "Speakers".
- Maximize volume
- Note that analog back panel highlights receptacle that amplified
speakers are plugged in to.
- Turn amplified speakers' amplifier up to max - giving a low-level of
white noise.
- Note that varying Windows' volume control has no effect on level
of white noise.
- Un-plug amplified speakers and note that white nose goes away.
- Plug amplified speakers into the same port on another PC, play some
music, and they work a-ok.
- Plug amplified speakers back into problem PC
- Open up Speakers | Sounds | Program Events
- Choose a sound.
- Click "Test", and the white noise stops for the duration of the sound,
but no sound comes out of speakers.
I'm doing something dumb.... but what?
Did you move the OS from an old system to a new system ?

Both with RealTek audio, but with different HDAudio ?

I suspect something like that happened here.

https://www.sevenforums.com/sound-audio/211917-realtek-onboard-sound-issue-no-sound.html

And you probably don't have a "mute" asserted or something.

*******

I had a strange case once, where one audio product, the driver *erased*
a key registry setting the other audio driver relied on. It took
Process Monitor, and skimming through a 100,000 event log, until
I spotted a suspicious entry the driver was checking for, and it
was not present (as seen in the log). Finding stuff like that
is pure lucky, due to the needle-in-haystack nature of that
kind of analysis.

*******

There are two methods of sensing a speaker connection.

(Note - I don't think this has anything to do with your problem.)

RealTek uses what's in the spec, which is jack side contacts.
So for a RealTek codec to know a speaker is plugged in, the
1/8" plug depresses a switch inside the jack. That's how it
knows "something is there", but not what is there.

If driving 32ohm headphones on Lineout, the driver needs to enable
the "boost", which is ready to drive 32 ohm loads up to 1 volt.
Without boost enabled, the noise floor is 10dB lower (that's good),
but the output is only in the 600 ohm range. And perhaps not
enough to drive headphones.

In the case of driving amplified speakers, the speaker input is
10K ohms, and either boost or no boost, will work an amplified speaker.

So with RealTek, some fiddling is required.

*******

Analog Devices (SoundMax people) invented an actual impedance
measurement technique. They place a 25KHz test signal on the port
(only your dog can hear that), and since all inputs and outputs
are capacitively coupled, their scheme has to measure the AC
current that flows, when an AC stimulus is applied. This is
how a SoundMax product knows a 10K load is connected, or a 32 ohm
load is connected. Their "Wizard" will still ask for confirmation,
because obviously a user can connect some piece of junk to the
box which fools the sensing.

As far as I know, that's not in the spec for HDAudio, and
they would have a patent on it.

*******

For RealTek front panel audio, the computer case cabling could
have "AC'97 wiring" or "HDAudio wiring". The alternatives exist,
if the two front jacks have been equipped with the side contact
switch thing.

On RealTek, if you connect HDAudio-type front wiring, there is
a hidden tick box to ask the CODEC to check the resistor ladder
for those front ports. Then, the RealTek can sense a plugged in
device.

If you use older wiring, which lacks side contacts, and you use
RealTek, it has no way to tell something is connected. Whether you
tick the hidden box or not, won't help, because AC'97 wiring doesn't
have any pins assigned for the side contact wiring.

So that's a quick overview.

In your case, I feel this is an "ancient driver" issue, and
perhaps uninstalling the RealTek from Programs and Features,
and installing a new one, might help. Other than that, I don't
have any suggested directions. I'm sure you've checked the
"default" tick box on playback, and it's really set to the
lineout speakers. The ancient driver could be messing with
port assignments, and maybe the sound is coming out on
another jack.

Paul
(PeteCresswell)
2017-05-29 21:40:34 UTC
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Post by Paul
Did you move the OS from an old system to a new system ?
Both with RealTek audio, but with different HDAudio ?
No: clean install from scratch... but I'll start reading the link.
--
Pete Cresswell
VanguardLH
2017-05-27 22:27:35 UTC
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Post by (PeteCresswell)
New GigaByte Z87X mobo with RelTek HD audio Manager.
Have installed, then re-installed audio drivers from GigaByte.
- Set RealTek HD Audio Manager to "Speakers".
- Maximize volume
- Note that analog back panel highlights receptacle that amplified
speakers are plugged in to.
- Turn amplified speakers' amplifier up to max - giving a low-level of
white noise.
- Note that varying Windows' volume control has no effect on level
of white noise.
- Un-plug amplified speakers and note that white nose goes away.
- Plug amplified speakers into the same port on another PC, play some
music, and they work a-ok.
- Plug amplified speakers back into problem PC
- Open up Speakers | Sounds | Program Events
- Choose a sound.
- Click "Test", and the white noise stops for the duration of the sound,
but no sound comes out of speakers.
I'm doing something dumb.... but what?
Don't know which version of Realtek's HD Audio Manager program you are
using. I have it show an icon in the system tray (but configured to
hide into the expanded view of the tray icon). I double-click on that
tray icon to show the Realtek HD Audio Manager. That is the RAVCpl64.exe
process in Task Manager's Applications tab. It is found under
C:\Program Files\Realtek\Audio\HDA\RAVCpl64.exe. I have the 64-bit
version of Windows 7 Home Edition x64 SP-1. You never mentioned which
bitwidth of the OS that you have. The program does not let you see what
version it is. That's why I needed the filename so I could right-click
on it to look at Properties -> Details.

I only have 2 front speakers (no rear, center, or bass [which is taken
care of by the Altec speakers themselves]). Under its Speaker
Configuration tab, I have "stereo" selected for Speaker Configuration
selection because I only connect to the stereo output - with the
backpanel display in the program shows as the green-colored jack (it is
bold, the others are grayed out). Also, "Full-range Speakers" is
enabled for "Front left and right" (the "Surround speakers" selection is
grayed out because I only have the 2 front speakers).

In the program itself, clicking on the "i" information button says:

Audio driver version: 6.0.1.5898
DirectX version: 11.0
Audio Controller: HD Audio
Audio Codec: ALC888S

Some or all of that would be different because you have different
hardware than do I. When I right-click on the RAVCpl64.exe and go to
Properties -> Details, both file and product versions are 1.0.0.386.

Neither in the Realtek program, its tray icon, or the Windows volume
tray icon are the speakers shown as muted.

The white noise is likely due to EMF induced into the chassis and ground
plane of the mobo from A/C power line or radio. When your speakers get
a signal, even a tiny one enough for it to detect there is a signal, it
probably uses some filtering to improve the quality of sound. So the
noise from the speakers goes away when you attempt to play some sound.

That tool only configures how the driver will tell the hardware on the
motherboard to be configured, not what Windows will use to where it
sends its audio output. Right-click on the Windows volume tray icon and
select Volume Mixer. Are either speakers or system sounds shown muted?
Right-click on the volume tray icon again and choose Volume Control
Options. Is the "All devices currently playing sound" option enabled?
Right-click on the volume tray icon again and pick Playback devices.
Windows differentiates between which "devices" (defined in the registry)
are used for playback and which are used for recording. That brings up
the Sound applet (same if you go into Control Panel -> Sound). For me
with my 2 speaker setup, and with the Playback tab selected, I scroll
down to find the Speakers device selected for output. It is also
selected as the default playback device. With it select, click on
Properties. Under the Levels tab, the Realtek HD Audio Output slider is
set at 40% which is also what the Windows volume tray icon shows, and
not muted. The other controls shown are for inputs. Two are disabled
(microphone - rear jack, front mic) and one is enabled (line-in). Since
I'm not using them, I could mute them, event the line-in jack.

Back in the Sound applet under its Playback tab and with the Speakers
device selected, I click on Configure. That gives me the test wizard
and maybe what you used. Since I only have 2 speakers (front), Audio
Channels is set to "Stereo". I click on the Test button and hear the
down-chime tone in the left speaker followed by the up-chime tone in the
right speaker. I click Next and see the full-range setting. Despite
seeing it enabled in another view, it is deselected here. I can enable
or disable it, click on a speaker to test, but hear no difference.
Alas, they play a mid-range chime tone without any bass so I won't be
able to tell the difference. Clicking Next just brings me to a summary
screen where I click Finish.

While you might have the Realtek tool properly configured for the
hardware how you want to use it, you still need to tell Windows which
device you want it to use for playback and recording. Under Sound ->
Playback, I have 6 digital audio devices defined, 2 "speaker" devices
defined (one shown with an RCA coax cord but I'm not using the coax jack
and another as a speaker icon and that one is selected as the default
playback device), another digital device (probably the optical output),
and an HDMI device (not using that jack, either). If you have a mic or
might later get one, go under the Recording tab and make sure one of
those inputs is selected as the default.
T
2017-05-27 23:14:48 UTC
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Post by (PeteCresswell)
New GigaByte Z87X mobo with RelTek HD audio Manager.
Have installed, then re-installed audio drivers from GigaByte.
- Set RealTek HD Audio Manager to "Speakers".
- Maximize volume
- Note that analog back panel highlights receptacle that amplified
speakers are plugged in to.
- Turn amplified speakers' amplifier up to max - giving a low-level of
white noise.
- Note that varying Windows' volume control has no effect on level
of white noise.
- Un-plug amplified speakers and note that white nose goes away.
- Plug amplified speakers into the same port on another PC, play some
music, and they work a-ok.
- Plug amplified speakers back into problem PC
- Open up Speakers | Sounds | Program Events
- Choose a sound.
- Click "Test", and the white noise stops for the duration of the sound,
but no sound comes out of speakers.
I'm doing something dumb.... but what?
If you are not muted somewhere, your default audio program
may be your HDMI (digital) system and not your regular
Audio system. I see this a lot.
(PeteCresswell)
2017-05-29 21:51:38 UTC
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Post by T
If you are not muted somewhere, your default audio program
may be your HDMI (digital) system and not your regular
Audio system. I see this a lot.
That sounds promising - since I had the bright ideal of retiring my DVI
cable in favor of an HDMI cable for one of my monitors.

Can you give some more context? I looked into "Windows 7 default
programs" but that's on a higher level - like whether to use Windows
Media Player or VLC to renter an audio recording.

Control Panel | Sound | Playback isn't showing me anything unexpected.
I've got "Speakers Realtex High Definition Audio Default Device"
selected and the owher three choices are:

- PA248 Intel Display Audio (that's one of my monitors)

- Realtek Digital Output (the speakers are analog)

- Realtek Digital Output (Optical): there's an Optical
port on the mobo, but I am not using it)
--
Pete Cresswell
T
2017-05-29 21:57:01 UTC
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Post by T
If you are not muted somewhere, your default audio program
may be your HDMI (digital) system and not your regular
Audio system. I see this a lot.
That sounds promising - since I had the bright ideal of retiring my DVI
cable in favor of an HDMI cable for one of my monitors.
Can you give some more context? I looked into "Windows 7 default
programs" but that's on a higher level - like whether to use Windows
Media Player or VLC to renter an audio recording.
Control Panel | Sound | Playback isn't showing me anything unexpected.
I've got "Speakers Realtex High Definition Audio Default Device"
- PA248 Intel Display Audio (that's one of my monitors)
- Realtek Digital Output (the speakers are analog)
- Realtek Digital Output (Optical): there's an Optical
port on the mobo, but I am not using it)
What I do is start playing something (Beethoven 5th
will do from You Tube), then start selecting the
Playback devices and see which one works.

Which one is set to your default?

Also, when in that dialog, grub around looking for
and volume controls set to off or mute.
T
2017-05-29 22:41:36 UTC
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Post by (PeteCresswell)
New GigaByte Z87X mobo with RelTek HD audio Manager.
Have installed, then re-installed audio drivers from GigaByte.
- Set RealTek HD Audio Manager to "Speakers".
- Maximize volume
- Note that analog back panel highlights receptacle that amplified
speakers are plugged in to.
- Turn amplified speakers' amplifier up to max - giving a low-level of
white noise.
- Note that varying Windows' volume control has no effect on level
of white noise.
- Un-plug amplified speakers and note that white nose goes away.
- Plug amplified speakers into the same port on another PC, play some
music, and they work a-ok.
- Plug amplified speakers back into problem PC
- Open up Speakers | Sounds | Program Events
- Choose a sound.
- Click "Test", and the white noise stops for the duration of the sound,
but no sound comes out of speakers.
I'm doing something dumb.... but what?
Hi Pete,

Not to ask too stupid a question, but do you have the
speaker plug in the right hole? It is typically the
green hole, but not always. I have seen it be
the black hole.

1) pull out the plug and press the end with your hand.
If your speakers are working, they will buzz (60 cycle
hum)

2) start something playing. Place the speaker plug
in all the holes, until something makes sound.

-T

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